1-1/8" threaded headset availability

[Steve Gravrock]

I have an old mountain bike that I use as a winter commuter and that
I'm thinking of setting up as a year-round errand bike. It's held up
very well except for the headset. 150 miles of snow and slush did this:

<http://www.panix.com/~sdg/bike/crown-race.jpg>

I've repacked with hopefully more waterproof grease and I plan to
service it more frequently in the future, but there's a good chance that
I'll be feeding it a steady diet of headsets no matter what I do. Which
brings me to my question. Am I going to be able to get 1-1/8" threaded
headsets in the future? I see that QBP no longer lists any except for
STX headsets, which haven't been made in years as far as I know. I think
Tange headsets are still available but I don't know if those are NOS or
still in production. I'd rather not shell out for Chris King if I can
avoid it.

Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
be available, or should I stock up now?

Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
the aforementioned STX?

[Alex]

On Jul 28, 5:49 pm, Steve Gravrock <use...@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:
> I have an old mountain bike that I use as a winter commuter and that
> I'm thinking of setting up as a year-round errand bike. It's held up
> very well except for the headset. 150 miles of snow and slush did this:
>
> <http://www.panix.com/~sdg/bike/crown-race.jpg>
>
> I've repacked with hopefully more waterproof grease and I plan to
> service it more frequently in the future, but there's a good chance that
> I'll be feeding it a steady diet of headsets no matter what I do. Which
> brings me to my question. Am I going to be able to get 1-1/8" threaded
> headsets in the future? I see that QBP no longer lists any except for
> STX headsets, which haven't been made in years as far as I know. I think
> Tange headsets are still available but I don't know if those are NOS or
> still in production. I'd rather not shell out for Chris King if I can
> avoid it.
>
> Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
> be available, or should I stock up now?
>
> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> the aforementioned STX?

The crown race is the same threaded or not. So that should not be an
issue. Put a
fender on the front wheel and you will extend the headsets life quite
a bit. You can
also try putting a section of old inner tube to cover the bottom
section of the headset.
---------------------
Alex

[landotter]

On Jul 28, 4:49 pm, Steve Gravrock <use...@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:
> I have an old mountain bike that I use as a winter commuter and that
> I'm thinking of setting up as a year-round errand bike. It's held up
> very well except for the headset. 150 miles of snow and slush did this:
>
> <http://www.panix.com/~sdg/bike/crown-race.jpg>
>
> I've repacked with hopefully more waterproof grease and I plan to
> service it more frequently in the future, but there's a good chance that
> I'll be feeding it a steady diet of headsets no matter what I do. Which
> brings me to my question. Am I going to be able to get 1-1/8" threaded
> headsets in the future? I see that QBP no longer lists any except for
> STX headsets, which haven't been made in years as far as I know. I think
> Tange headsets are still available but I don't know if those are NOS or
> still in production. I'd rather not shell out for Chris King if I can
> avoid it.
>
> Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
> be available, or should I stock up now?

Tioga headsets are $10 from a seller on Amazon. At that price, you can
get enough for a lifetime.
>
> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> the aforementioned STX?

I like the STX, it's a cheap and smoooth headset. I installed on on a
road bike, so can't tell ya how they hold up off road. ~$20

[Joel Mayes]

On 2007-07-28, Steve Gravrock <usenet@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:

> Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
> be available, or should I stock up now?
>
> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> the aforementioned STX?


We've got a steady supply of YST 1 1/8 threaded headset at work, not
great quality but good enough.

Have you considered puting a length of old inner tube around fork
crown/head tube join? It's an easy way to improve the sealing of the
bottom race.

Cheers

Joel

--
Human Powered Cycles | High quality servicing and repairs
joel@humanpowered.com.au | Affordable second hand bikes
(03) 9029 6504 | Bicycle reuse centre
www.humanpowered.com.au | Mechanical and on-road training and instruction

[Nate Knutson]

On Jul 28, 2:49 pm, Steve Gravrock <use...@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:
> I have an old mountain bike that I use as a winter commuter and that
> I'm thinking of setting up as a year-round errand bike. It's held up
> very well except for the headset. 150 miles of snow and slush did this:
>
> <http://www.panix.com/~sdg/bike/crown-race.jpg>
>
> I've repacked with hopefully more waterproof grease and I plan to
> service it more frequently in the future, but there's a good chance that
> I'll be feeding it a steady diet of headsets no matter what I do. Which
> brings me to my question. Am I going to be able to get 1-1/8" threaded
> headsets in the future? I see that QBP no longer lists any except for
> STX headsets, which haven't been made in years as far as I know. I think
> Tange headsets are still available but I don't know if those are NOS or
> still in production. I'd rather not shell out for Chris King if I can
> avoid it.
>
> Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
> be available, or should I stock up now?
>
> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> the aforementioned STX?

All the decent options except King might go away eventually, but 1
1/8" threaded is still really common as it's what many new comfort
bikes and other low-end bikes currently use, so you'll likely always
be able to at least get a POS with crappy sealing.

There's also a Ritchey Logic 1 1/8" threaded still available.

Headsets mostly get trashed from poor frame prep, use of retainers if
it's non-cartridge, incorrect adjustment, and lack of maintenance.
Take care of all that and you shouldn't have to worry about going
through them.

[A Muzi]

Steve Gravrock wrote:
> I have an old mountain bike that I use as a winter commuter and that
> I'm thinking of setting up as a year-round errand bike. It's held up
> very well except for the headset. 150 miles of snow and slush did this:
>
> <http://www.panix.com/~sdg/bike/crown-race.jpg>
>
> I've repacked with hopefully more waterproof grease and I plan to
> service it more frequently in the future, but there's a good chance that
> I'll be feeding it a steady diet of headsets no matter what I do. Which
> brings me to my question. Am I going to be able to get 1-1/8" threaded
> headsets in the future? I see that QBP no longer lists any except for
> STX headsets, which haven't been made in years as far as I know. I think
> Tange headsets are still available but I don't know if those are NOS or
> still in production. I'd rather not shell out for Chris King if I can
> avoid it.
>
> Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
> be available, or should I stock up now?
>
> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> the aforementioned STX?

Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
bikes for 2007, not rare.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Zog The Undeniable]

Steve Gravrock wrote:
> I have an old mountain bike that I use as a winter commuter and that
> I'm thinking of setting up as a year-round errand bike. It's held up
> very well except for the headset. 150 miles of snow and slush did this:
>
> <http://www.panix.com/~sdg/bike/crown-race.jpg>
>
> I've repacked with hopefully more waterproof grease and I plan to
> service it more frequently in the future, but there's a good chance that
> I'll be feeding it a steady diet of headsets no matter what I do. Which
> brings me to my question. Am I going to be able to get 1-1/8" threaded
> headsets in the future? I see that QBP no longer lists any except for
> STX headsets, which haven't been made in years as far as I know. I think
> Tange headsets are still available but I don't know if those are NOS or
> still in production. I'd rather not shell out for Chris King if I can
> avoid it.
>
> Can I continue buying headsets as needed, confident that they will still
> be available, or should I stock up now?
>
> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> the aforementioned STX?

If the worst comes to the worst, you just buy a new fork and stem.
Threaded or unthreaded has nothing to do with the frame itself.

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-07-28, landotter <landotter@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 28, 4:49 pm, Steve Gravrock <use...@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:

>> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
>> the aforementioned STX?
>
> I like the STX, it's a cheap and smoooth headset. I installed on on a
> road bike, so can't tell ya how they hold up off road. ~$20

At that price, why not?

What do you think of the seals? I suspect that was the main problem with
my old one. The grease wasn't entirely washed out but it was definitely
contaminated. I'm hoping that a better-sealed headset plus fenders and
some kind of gasket around the head tube/crown race junction will help
the situation.

This bike's off-road days are over. Once upon a time it was my
do-everything bike, but there reached a point where I was crashing too
much and needed either front suspension or much better skills. I could
get front suspension a lot more quickly.

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-07-28, Joel Mayes <j.mayes@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> Have you considered puting a length of old inner tube around fork
> crown/head tube join? It's an easy way to improve the sealing of the
> bottom race.

I'll give that a try. Thanks.

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-07-28, Nate Knutson <bikenate@riseup.net> wrote:

> Headsets mostly get trashed from poor frame prep, use of retainers if
> it's non-cartridge, incorrect adjustment, and lack of maintenance.
> Take care of all that and you shouldn't have to worry about going
> through them.

In this case I'm inclined to blame poor inadequate sealing and a hostile
environment rather than any of those factors. The headset had a couple
of thousand miles on it and looked new at the start of the winter. I'd
packed it with loose balls and Park grease and adjusted it properly.
That was 150 miles before the picture I posted.

On the other hand, the LX hubs on that bike have held up very well.

[Chalo]

A Muzi wrote:
>
> Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> bikes for 2007, not rare.

You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?

Chalo

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-07-29, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

> Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> bikes for 2007, not rare.

That's a relief. Everything else on the bike is bog-standard and easily
available new except perhaps for the 7 speed shifters, and those may
very well outlive the frame.

[Hank Wirtz]

On Jul 28, 9:23 pm, Chalo <chalo.col...@gmail.com> wrote:
> A Muzi wrote:
>
> > Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> > bikes for 2007, not rare.
>
> You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
>
> Chalo

The Trek Lime springs to mind...

[A Muzi]

> A Muzi wrote:
>> Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
>> bikes for 2007, not rare.

Chalo wrote:
> You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
> Chalo

A broad swath of $70 to $400 hybrids, many varieties XMart to Famous Names.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[A Muzi]

> A Muzi wrote:
>> Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
>> bikes for 2007, not rare.

Chalo wrote:
> You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?


p.s. It's done to use the tall 'adjustable angle' quill stems.
Threadless adjustable stems have a restricted height range.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Chalo]

Hank Wirtz wrote:
>
> Chalo wrote:
>
> > A Muzi wrote:
> > >
> > > Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> > > bikes for 2007, not rare.
> >
> > You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
>
> The Trek Lime springs to mind...

How 'bout that? So it is. I can't tell whether the Lime's strange-
looking "semi-integrated" headset could be fitted to an older threaded/
OS frame, but it is certainly a threaded 1-1/8 headset on a new
bike.

Chalo

[landotter]

On Jul 29, 1:39 pm, Steve Gravrock <use...@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:
> On 2007-07-28, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 28, 4:49 pm, Steve Gravrock <use...@sdg.users.panix.com> wrote:
> >> Also, would I be any better off with a cartridge bearing headset like
> >> the aforementioned STX?
>
> > I like the STX, it's a cheap and smoooth headset. I installed on on a
> > road bike, so can't tell ya how they hold up off road. ~$20
>
> At that price, why not?
>
> What do you think of the seals?

It seems pretty weather resistant and the design is such that water
will have to be pretty determined to get in. Two years and a few
fenderless rain rides on mine, and it's still buttery. For $20, ya
can't beat it.

[Nate Knutson]

On Jul 29, 11:49 am, Chalo <chalo.col...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hank Wirtz wrote:
>
> > Chalo wrote:
>
> > > A Muzi wrote:
>
> > > > Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> > > > bikes for 2007, not rare.
>
> > > You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
>
> > The Trek Lime springs to mind...
>
> How 'bout that? So it is. I can't tell whether the Lime's strange-
> looking "semi-integrated" headset could be fitted to an older threaded/
> OS frame, but it is certainly a threaded 1-1/8 headset on a new
> bike.
>
> Chalo


1 1/8 threaded has never come close to going away. It's the most
common size for comfort bikes, and bike shops sell tons of those. It's
also pretty common for fancy cruisers, dealer-level multispeed kids
bikes, cheap hybrids, and probably some other categories.

[Gary Young]

On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 18:46:48 -0700, Nate Knutson wrote:

> On Jul 29, 11:49 am, Chalo <chalo.col...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hank Wirtz wrote:
>>
>> > Chalo wrote:
>>
>> > > A Muzi wrote:
>>
>> > > > Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
>> > > > bikes for 2007, not rare.
>>
>> > > You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
>>
>> > The Trek Lime springs to mind...
>>
>> How 'bout that? So it is. I can't tell whether the Lime's strange-
>> looking "semi-integrated" headset could be fitted to an older threaded/
>> OS frame, but it is certainly a threaded 1-1/8 headset on a new
>> bike.
>>
>> Chalo
>
>
> 1 1/8 threaded has never come close to going away. It's the most
> common size for comfort bikes, and bike shops sell tons of those. It's
> also pretty common for fancy cruisers, dealer-level multispeed kids
> bikes, cheap hybrids, and probably some other categories.

This would seem to call into question the idea, frequently repeated here,
that bike manufacturers moved to threadless stems as a cost-cutting
measure.

[Michael Press]

In article
<VfadnR_2renw2TDbnZ2dnUVZ_sDinZ2d@giganews.com>,
Gary Young <garyyoung3@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 18:46:48 -0700, Nate Knutson wrote:
>
> > On Jul 29, 11:49 am, Chalo <chalo.col...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Hank Wirtz wrote:
> >>
> >> > Chalo wrote:
> >>
> >> > > A Muzi wrote:
> >>
> >> > > > Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> >> > > > bikes for 2007, not rare.
> >>
> >> > > You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
> >>
> >> > The Trek Lime springs to mind...
> >>
> >> How 'bout that? So it is. I can't tell whether the Lime's strange-
> >> looking "semi-integrated" headset could be fitted to an older threaded/
> >> OS frame, but it is certainly a threaded 1-1/8 headset on a new
> >> bike.
> >>
> >> Chalo
> >
> >
> > 1 1/8 threaded has never come close to going away. It's the most
> > common size for comfort bikes, and bike shops sell tons of those. It's
> > also pretty common for fancy cruisers, dealer-level multispeed kids
> > bikes, cheap hybrids, and probably some other categories.
>
> This would seem to call into question the idea, frequently repeated here,
> that bike manufacturers moved to threadless stems as a cost-cutting
> measure.

The history is not conducive to simple pronouncements.
The thread-less steerer tube/headset/stem design was
created for mountain bicycling because the quill stem
does not adequately sustain the forces induced by
bunny-hopping a bicycle over rough terrain. The
manufacturers _may_ have adopted the design to reduce
costs, or not. Maybe they adopted the design because
mountain bikers want it, and manufacturers would rather
build one steering system rather than two. The
thread-less design has no drawbacks for road bicycles.
(Unless one counts appearance, which I do. I much
prefer the appearance to the quill stem, but adopted
the thread-less design anyway. I mitigated the
appearance problem with the TTT mutant stem.
<http://www.xxcycle.com/php/boutique/page.php?nom=PRODUI
Tpp&key=52&FROM=bestwebbuys>
)

--
Michael Press

[Chalo]

A Muzi wrote:
>
> > A Muzi wrote:
> >>
> >> Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
> >> bikes for 2007, not rare.
>
> Chalo wrote:
> >
> > You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?
>
> p.s. It's done to use the tall 'adjustable angle' quill stems.
> Threadless adjustable stems have a restricted height range.

It makes sense to me, but not entirely. I wonder what about the more
common 1" threaded size makes it less desirable for such
applications? It's not like comfort/cruiser bikes or their riders are
particularly sensitive to small variations in weight or steer tube
stiffness.

Chalo

[A Muzi]

>>> A Muzi wrote:
>>>> Current product at Tange and YST. O/S threaded headsets are used on new
>>>> bikes for 2007, not rare.

>> Chalo wrote:
>>> You are kidding me. What bikes would those be?

> A Muzi wrote:
>> p.s. It's done to use the tall 'adjustable angle' quill stems.
>> Threadless adjustable stems have a restricted height range.

Chalo wrote:
> It makes sense to me, but not entirely. I wonder what about the more
> common 1" threaded size makes it less desirable for such
> applications? It's not like comfort/cruiser bikes or their riders are
> particularly sensitive to small variations in weight or steer tube
> stiffness.

OK, we agree. Heck I ride 1" quill format myself.

But manufacturers mostly seem to go 1-1/8 threaded on hybrids and 1-1/8
threadless on everything else.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Chalo]

On Jul 30, 3:58 pm, A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
> Chalo wrote:
> > I wonder what about the more
> > common 1" threaded size makes it less desirable for such
> > applications? It's not like comfort/cruiser bikes or their riders are
> > particularly sensitive to small variations in weight or steer tube
> > stiffness.
>
> OK, we agree. Heck I ride 1" quill format myself.
>
> But manufacturers mostly seem to go 1-1/8 threaded on hybrids and 1-1/8
> threadless on everything else.

I guess that means fewer head tubes, head tube mitering tools, fixture
tooling, and reamers. I'll buy that. I wish it had been 1-1/4", but
c'est la vie.

Chalo

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-08-06, Zog The Undeniable <hrothgar19@yahoo.com> wrote:

> If the worst comes to the worst, you just buy a new fork and stem.
> Threaded or unthreaded has nothing to do with the frame itself.

That's an option. If it comes to that, how closely will I need to match
the axle to crown length? I measured my current fork at 395mm. The
closest matches I can find at a glance are 413mm and 390mm.