What are key things to look for as a minimum for a decent, useable bike?

[Doc]

I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?

I was driving down the road a while back and saw a kid on a bike of
unknown origin who was going to cross a busy street, and just as he
leaned on it to speed across, after about 2 pumps, one of the
(plastic?) pedals simply snapped off, sending him tumbling hard to the
pavement into the path of traffic on a blind curve and I thought I was
about to witness a fatality. By some miracle, the next car coming
around the bend saw him and slammed on the brakes in time. I'm sure
that kid needed a change of underwear.

When I was a little kid riding my approximately 1970 Schwinn 3-speed,
I never heard of a pedal simply snapping off like that. Now, this kid
couldn't have weighed 80 lbs, doesn't seem he could put that much
stress on the pieces. Seems almost criminal that something could be
that cheaply made and sold.

Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.

So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
it. ;-)

I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
the real world.

I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?

Thanks for all input.

[SMS]

Doc wrote:

> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)

I'd get a steel touring or street bicycle with no suspension.

It's hard to give a price. You can get a perfectly serviceable Cromo 520
bicycle such as the Bianchi Avenue for $350 (less on sale). Or you can
move up to a true touring bicycle such as the Fuji Touring (seems to be
no 2007 model, but I've seen the 2006 in the stores still) for around
$800. There's also the REI Randonee, which is Cromo 520.

I guess my top choice would be the Surly Long Haul Trucker,
"http://www.surlybikes.com/lht_comp.html". It's got a 4130 Cromo frame,
and it's not much more than the REI Randonee, though the Randonee often
goes on sale while the LHT is perpetually sold out so I don't think they
have any incentive to put them on sale.

The more you spend, the higher grade the components.

[Road Dog]

The Wal-wart stuff is not very upgradeable. They have
non-standard parts - bottom brackets, rear end widths,
and even wheels - such that swapping with a better part
is difficult to impossible.

If you really want to spend as little as possible for
a decent bike that you don't really want anything from
except comfort and strength, the answer is craigslist.
More $50 steel-frame non-suspended bikes than you can
ride in a life-time. Learn your size, then go try them
out. (Better than ebay is this respect.) Stick to
name brands.

[Michael Press]

In article
<1185903792.716880.176420@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.c om>,
Doc <docsavage20@yahoo.com> wrote:

> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike?

Buy a department store bicycle and take your chances.

Shop around until you find a bicycle shop you think you
can trust. You will pay more for a better bicycle. A
good shop will help you find the right style of bicycle
and the right size. Most shops understand enough to put
you on a bicycle that will not break down, and will
last a long while with maintenance.

> I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?
>
> Thanks for all input.

--
Michael Press

[datakoll]

On Jul 31, 1:43 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?
>
> I was driving down the road a while back and saw a kid on a bike of
> unknown origin who was going to cross a busy street, and just as he
> leaned on it to speed across, after about 2 pumps, one of the
> (plastic?) pedals simply snapped off, sending him tumbling hard to the
> pavement into the path of traffic on a blind curve and I thought I was
> about to witness a fatality. By some miracle, the next car coming
> around the bend saw him and slammed on the brakes in time. I'm sure
> that kid needed a change of underwear.
>
> When I was a little kid riding my approximately 1970 Schwinn 3-speed,
> I never heard of a pedal simply snapping off like that. Now, this kid
> couldn't have weighed 80 lbs, doesn't seem he could put that much
> stress on the pieces. Seems almost criminal that something could be
> that cheaply made and sold.
>
> Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?
>
> Thanks for all input.

wal's $100+ Avalon series is a buy if you fit the frame and lube it
properly, fit tire's suitable for your use pattern. there's not much
on the horizon to compete with it at $100-130 whatever the exchange
rate this month.
there's not much room for savings over the Avalon on a rebuild unless
you find an exotic frame and borrow the tools.
consider Johnson and Johnson et al laid off this week. at least LBS
can sell Chinese/Tiwanese.

[Sir Ridesalot]

On Jul 31, 1:43 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?
>
Snipped:
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?
>
> Thanks for all input.


Hi there.

Some observations.

Many department store bikes are not properly assembled or adjusted for
safe use. I have seen far too many bikes in department stores where
the front wheel quick release was not locked or tightened properly.
These bikes have the cheapest fastest wearing and fiddly components on
them.

Another problem with department store bikes is after sales service and/
or warranty work. A decent bike shop will make sure the bike is
properly set up for you especially if you buy it during a less busy
time of the week or day. Saturday is not the best day in many cases.

I have seen customers go into a local department store with a bike
they bought the day before that needed a *SIMPLE* adjustment only to
be told that they would have to leave their bike for a week.

Even if you like to tinker with a bike I feel you are better off
getting some thing from a reputable bike shop. A department store bike
will cost a fair bit to upgrade to some thing that is even remotely
dependable. They will appraise your needs and match you to a good
bike.

I hope this helps.

Cheers from Peter

[Peter Cole]

Doc wrote:
> Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.

At your size you are kind of pushing the envelope on entry level bikes.
For what you want to do you might be OK on a $250-300 bike store bought
hybrid or mountain bike. Of course you can spend more than that but you
wouldn't necessarily get better durability.

At roughly your size, the problems I've had with components have been:
wheels, bottom brackets (bearing/axle assembly for cranks) and pedals. I
would upgrade the pedals, make sure the bike shop knows how to set up
the wheels (adjust tension & stress relieve) or learn to do it myself,
and just replace the other components with better stuff if/once they fail.

If you use off-road stuff for the road you get some safety margin for
overloading. Using that strategy you might want to go with a MTB set up
with narrow, smooth tires -- essentially a hybrid.

[DanKMTB@gmail.com]

On Jul 31, 1:43 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?
>
> I was driving down the road a while back and saw a kid on a bike of
> unknown origin who was going to cross a busy street, and just as he
> leaned on it to speed across, after about 2 pumps, one of the
> (plastic?) pedals simply snapped off, sending him tumbling hard to the
> pavement into the path of traffic on a blind curve and I thought I was
> about to witness a fatality. By some miracle, the next car coming
> around the bend saw him and slammed on the brakes in time. I'm sure
> that kid needed a change of underwear.
>
> When I was a little kid riding my approximately 1970 Schwinn 3-speed,
> I never heard of a pedal simply snapping off like that. Now, this kid
> couldn't have weighed 80 lbs, doesn't seem he could put that much
> stress on the pieces. Seems almost criminal that something could be
> that cheaply made and sold.
>
> Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?
>
> Thanks for all input.

Search this place for "walgoose" and "walmart" for some reading on the
XMart bikes. They're gist is they're not bicycles, they're bicycle
shaped toys. Hit up a bike shop. If you want to save some coin, get
something used. Many bike shops sell decent used bikes, and a decent
bike shop bike for a beginner shouldn't cost more than a couple o few
hundred if you can get one used. Expect to spend 500ish new.
When it comes to real bikes, not bike shaped toys, it's hard to go
wrong - especially for the entry level riding you describe. Fit is
key, but if it fits, it's comfortable to ride and it's a real bike you
should be ok. With a walgoose, you can't go right.

[G.T.]

Doc wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch?

There's the catch. You, along with many others, think they're
slick-looking enough that they might be usable.

> I.e. compromises in basic quality?

Of course.

>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?

Generally not. Dumpster diving will usually find you a better bike to
work on.

Greg

--
Ticketmaster sucks:
http://www.ticketmastersucks.org

Dethink to survive - Mclusky

[landotter]

On Jul 31, 12:43 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?
>
> I was driving down the road a while back and saw a kid on a bike of
> unknown origin who was going to cross a busy street, and just as he
> leaned on it to speed across, after about 2 pumps, one of the
> (plastic?) pedals simply snapped off, sending him tumbling hard to the
> pavement into the path of traffic on a blind curve and I thought I was
> about to witness a fatality. By some miracle, the next car coming
> around the bend saw him and slammed on the brakes in time. I'm sure
> that kid needed a change of underwear.
>
> When I was a little kid riding my approximately 1970 Schwinn 3-speed,
> I never heard of a pedal simply snapping off like that.

1970 Schwinn...you could probably put the entire neighborhood on that
thing and it would have held up! Viva electroforging!

> couldn't have weighed 80 lbs, doesn't seem he could put that much
> stress on the pieces. Seems almost criminal that something could be
> that cheaply made and sold.
>
> Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.

A used rigid mtb with ~1.75" street tread tires is the ultimate
affordable and bulletproof hucker. Plenty to be found for under a
hundred bucks on Craigslist. For example on my local, you can get a
virtually brand new Raleigh SC30 for $100:

http://nashville.craigslist.org/bik/385739771.html

>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?

I'm sure you could spend $50 on a Wally World bike to swap out some of
the gimpier **** like the ball bearings and whatnot, but you're better
off buying something used that was good quality to begin with. That
said, the Xmarts of the world have been starting to stock bikes in the
$200 range that could likely be brought up to snuff if you abhor
buying used.

[Nate Knutson]

On Jul 31, 10:43 am, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?
>
> I was driving down the road a while back and saw a kid on a bike of
> unknown origin who was going to cross a busy street, and just as he
> leaned on it to speed across, after about 2 pumps, one of the
> (plastic?) pedals simply snapped off, sending him tumbling hard to the
> pavement into the path of traffic on a blind curve and I thought I was
> about to witness a fatality. By some miracle, the next car coming
> around the bend saw him and slammed on the brakes in time. I'm sure
> that kid needed a change of underwear.
>
> When I was a little kid riding my approximately 1970 Schwinn 3-speed,
> I never heard of a pedal simply snapping off like that. Now, this kid
> couldn't have weighed 80 lbs, doesn't seem he could put that much
> stress on the pieces. Seems almost criminal that something could be
> that cheaply made and sold.
>
> Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?
>
> Thanks for all input.

Look for a hybrid with a rigid chromo steel fork and a cassette rear
hub in the $400-$500 range. You don't want a suspension fork because
cheap ones aren't adjustable to handle heavier people without sagging
uselessly and bottoming out all the time. You want a bike with a
cassette hub as opposed to a freewheel hub because heavier people
inevitably bend/destroy axles on freewheel hubs that come on current
cheap bikes. Presuming you're in the US market, the Jamis Coda and the
KHS Urban X-press are some really good bikes in this category. There
are others but not a lot. There's a road bike or two out there in this
price range that would work okay too.

[Art Harris]

Doc wrote:
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it.

First you want a large frame for your height. Most Walmart bikes come
as "one size fits all."

Next you want strong wheels for your weight. I'd go with 36 spokes
front and rear, with good quality DT spokes, and a strong rim. And
have then tensioned and stress relieved by someone who knows what
they're doing.

Obviously stay away from stupid light components (frame, stem,
handlebar, etc.).

For the kind of riding you describe, avoid shock absorbers. But choose
rims and tires that are wide enough to provide comfort, traction, and
shock absorption. 700 x 28 or 700 x 32 tires would be a good choice.

Good Luck,
Art Harris

[frkrygow@gmail.com]

On Jul 31, 1:43 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?

In some ways, cheap bikes are better than they used to be. But I
think you're better off getting a bike at a real bike shop - even a
used bike - than getting a cheap bike at a *-mart.

In my view, even if you were comparing two identical bikes, the bike
shop version would have the advantages of proper fit and proper
setup. Here are some details:

Fit is pretty critical with bikes, assuming you're doing more than
just pedaling around the block. The machine has to fit you. Most *-
Mart bikes come in one size, and since you're 6'3" that size isn't
going to be what you need. A decent bike shop should get you the size
bike you need, plus adjust it to fit you, while educating you on how
to make fine adjustments later.

Setup is also critical. Just last week, I helped out some neighbors.
Their kid really liked his new bike, except that he complained about
the hand brakes. Dad said "They really are hard to operate. Are they
supposed to be that hard to squeeze?" [Of course not!]

Turns out the front brake's single pivot was way too tight, the back
brake's was a little too tight, and the brake cables were completely
unlubricated and badly aligned. In half an hour, I had the brakes
working well. A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out
the door like that. But a department store? Well, I still remember
seeing a "Sears Best!" road bike on a big display pedestal, with it's
brake levers mounted upside down. The 16-year-old they'd hired to
assemble it simply didn't know better.

Regarding specifics on bikes: You might do best with a low-end, no-
suspension mountain bike. Suspension is heavily promoted to guys like
you, but it's counterproductive for road riding, especially in the
price range you want. That includes things like a springy seat post.
Get smooth tires, not knobbies. At 260 pounds, you want good strong
wheels, and definitely aluminum rims, not chromed steel. Unless your
area is extremely flat, you'll want three front sprockets (the
default). And no plastic parts, except perhaps the saddle body.

- Frank Krygowski

[David L. Johnson]

Doc wrote:
> I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?

You assume correctly.

> So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> it. ;-)

Look inside a real bike shop, first. At your size, you will need a
strong bike (no offense meant; I need one, too). I would recommend, for
riding on roads, to get either a "touring" style road bike, or a cross
bike. Hybrids would be a third, lesser, choice, since they tend to have
worse components. Good, strong, mountain bikes would be easier to find,
but only go that route if you actually want to ride off-road. Mountain
bikes are slower on roads than road type bikes (gee), and it just
wouldn't be as much fun.
>
> I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> the real world.

OK, you are talking about road bikes. So, touring bikes would be good
for you, but tend to be pricier, starting at $1000 or so. Hybrids are
much cheaper, starting at more like $500, but the low end ones are
cheaply made, heavy, and slow. A "street bike" is another option that
you might check out; they tend to be around $700 and have better brakes
than most hybrids (often they have disk brakes, not my favorite, but
some like them), and better components.

An exception to the "go to bike shops" rule would be if you have either
an REI or LL Bean in your area. Both of those outlets have a decent
selection of bikes of these sorts (in several sizes -- you will probably
need the biggest one offered), and have a mechanic who sometimes knows
what he is doing.
>
> I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?

Not the Wall-mart type. They are not worth sinking money into.

--

David L. Johnson

Let's be straight here. If we find something we can't understand we
like to call it something you can't understand, or indeed even
pronounce.
-- Douglas Adams

[SMS]

landotter wrote:

> A used rigid mtb with ~1.75" street tread tires is the ultimate
> affordable and bulletproof hucker. Plenty to be found for under a
> hundred bucks on Craigslist. For example on my local, you can get a
> virtually brand new Raleigh SC30 for $100:

This is the sort of bike that the more knowledgeable shop employees will
recommend for the 10+ y.o.. Alas, it's not easy to find a rigid mtb new.

A guy at REI says he sells a lot of the Marin Muir Woods as a
"bulletroof bike". No suspension, and a steel frame.
"http://www.marinbikes.com/bicycles_2007/html/bikes/bike_specs/specs_muirwoods.html".
Not cheap at $429. I bought a used Univega on craigslist for $25 for a
family member and fixed it up.

[Scott Gordo]

On Jul 31, 2:05 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 12:43 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > I'm assuming with these slick-looking sub-$100 wonders at WalMart,
> > there's a catch? I.e. compromises in basic quality?
>
> > I was driving down the road a while back and saw a kid on a bike of
> > unknown origin who was going to cross a busy street, and just as he
> > leaned on it to speed across, after about 2 pumps, one of the
> > (plastic?) pedals simply snapped off, sending him tumbling hard to the
> > pavement into the path of traffic on a blind curve and I thought I was
> > about to witness a fatality. By some miracle, the next car coming
> > around the bend saw him and slammed on the brakes in time. I'm sure
> > that kid needed a change of underwear.
>
> > When I was a little kid riding my approximately 1970 Schwinn 3-speed,
> > I never heard of a pedal simply snapping off like that.
>
> 1970 Schwinn...you could probably put the entire neighborhood on that
> thing and it would have held up! Viva electroforging!
>
>
>
>
>
> > couldn't have weighed 80 lbs, doesn't seem he could put that much
> > stress on the pieces. Seems almost criminal that something could be
> > that cheaply made and sold.
>
> > Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> > So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> > bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> > thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> > never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> > that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> > it. ;-)
>
> > I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> > handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> > sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> > across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> > the real world.
>
> A used rigid mtb with ~1.75" street tread tires is the ultimate
> affordable and bulletproof hucker. Plenty to be found for under a
> hundred bucks on Craigslist. For example on my local, you can get a
> virtually brand new Raleigh SC30 for $100:
>
> http://nashville.craigslist.org/bik/385739771.html
>
>
>
> > I'm also a tinkerer and am more than willing to perform maintenance
> > and upkeep. Also, are there any of these inexpensive bikes that can be
> > turned into something decent with a couple of parts substitutions?
>
> I'm sure you could spend $50 on a Wally World bike to swap out some of
> the gimpier **** like the ball bearings and whatnot, but you're better
> off buying something used that was good quality to begin with. That
> said, the Xmarts of the world have been starting to stock bikes in the
> $200 range that could likely be brought up to snuff if you abhor
> buying used.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Seconded.

The fewer moving parts the better, especially if you're buying used
and you're price conscious.

An adult sized version of you 70's Schwinn 3 speed would actually be a
good candidate. Like landotter says, I have never, ever seen a broken
electroforged frame.

I've seen this bike in my LBS, MSRP $285:
http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/07_bikes/commuter1.html
It's nice and looks pretty durable, though people aren't crazy about
the moustache handlebars and those adjustable stems kinda suck but
they'll give you a comfortable riding position before you swap it out
for a regular welded stem.

This gimmick looks pretty nice too, $350 MSRP.

http://www.konaworld.com/bikes/2k7/SMOKE/index.html

It looks like the same cromo frame as my 1999ish Fire Mountain w/rigid
fork, which has served me well as a beater bike.

/s

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-07-31, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
> landotter wrote:
>
>> A used rigid mtb with ~1.75" street tread tires is the ultimate
>> affordable and bulletproof hucker. Plenty to be found for under a
>> hundred bucks on Craigslist. For example on my local, you can get a
>> virtually brand new Raleigh SC30 for $100:
>
> This is the sort of bike that the more knowledgeable shop employees will
> recommend for the 10+ y.o.. Alas, it's not easy to find a rigid mtb new.

And when you can, they're usually expensive boutique items. Too bad. As
a practical matter I think there's still room for good quality bottom of
the line rigid mountain bikes, but most people who are shopping in that
price range aren't knowledgeable enough to see the lack of suspension as
an advantage.


> A guy at REI says he sells a lot of the Marin Muir Woods as a
> "bulletroof bike". No suspension, and a steel frame.
> "http://www.marinbikes.com/bicycles_2007/html/bikes/bike_specs/specs_muirwoods.html".
> Not cheap at $429.

That's probably the closet match to my old Trek 830, which cost $300 in
1997 and is still going strong.

[Hank Wirtz]

On Jul 31, 11:47 am, Scott Gordo <blubberp...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I've seen this bike in my LBS, MSRP $285:http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/07_bikes/commuter1.html
> It's nice and looks pretty durable, though people aren't crazy about
> the moustache handlebars and those adjustable stems kinda suck but
> they'll give you a comfortable riding position before you swap it out
> for a regular welded stem.
>

North Road, AKA Nitto Dove Bars are DA BOMB. I've got a set on my
cruiser, and they are astoundingly comfortable. Wrap the front
sections, and you can grab them as another grip position, or rest your
forearms in the curves for a headwind position that still lets you
steer (which you can't do as well with a wider cruiser bar, like an
Albatross). Those, plus a Nexus8 hub made my old '85 Peugeot Orient
Express MTB fun to ride again.

[Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman]

Frank Krygowski wrote:
> ...Well, I still remember
> seeing a "Sears Best!" road bike on a big display pedestal, with it's
> brake levers mounted upside down. The 16-year-old they'd hired to
> assemble it simply didn't know better....

What's wrong with upside down brake levers? They work fine for me:
<http://www.ihpva.org/incoming/2002/Dragonflyer/df4.jpg>. ;)

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[Steve Gravrock]

On 2007-07-31, frkrygow@gmail.com <frkrygow@gmail.com> wrote:

[ Bike shaped objects ]

> Setup is also critical. Just last week, I helped out some neighbors.
> Their kid really liked his new bike, except that he complained about
> the hand brakes. Dad said "They really are hard to operate. Are they
> supposed to be that hard to squeeze?" [Of course not!]
>
> Turns out the front brake's single pivot was way too tight, the back
> brake's was a little too tight, and the brake cables were completely
> unlubricated and badly aligned. In half an hour, I had the brakes
> working well. A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out
> the door like that. But a department store? Well, I still remember
> seeing a "Sears Best!" road bike on a big display pedestal, with it's
> brake levers mounted upside down. The 16-year-old they'd hired to
> assemble it simply didn't know better.

These days, discount stores generally contract that work out to someone
who's paid by the bike, not by the hour. There is very little
accountability for assembly mistakes even when the customer brings the
bike back, which they usually do. I used to work in those places, and
watching the contractor put bikes together was enough to ensure that I'd
never buy one there.

Some X-Mart bikes come properly assembled and adjusted, but it's not
uncommon for them to require a full bike shop tune-up. That service
costs about as much as the bike did in the first place.

[Tim McNamara]

In article <1185907885.171864.149960@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups. com>,
frkrygow@gmail.com wrote:

> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door like
> that.

Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's question
IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the OP tells us where
he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or more of us can recommend
a good bike shop.

[SMS]

Steve Gravrock wrote:

> And when you can, they're usually expensive boutique items. Too bad. As
> a practical matter I think there's still room for good quality bottom of
> the line rigid mountain bikes, but most people who are shopping in that
> price range aren't knowledgeable enough to see the lack of suspension as
> an advantage.

This is true. It's annoying how products that were once mainstream
suddenly become boutique, with much higher prices. I guess Rivendell and
Surly are happy about this.

I went shopping last week for a bike for my 12 y.o. niece and there
really was nothing in a rigid bike, at least not at the price most
people are willing to pay for a bicycle that the kid will outgrow in two
years. Complicating things were that her mother is a physical therapist,
so proper posture on the bike was a requirement. This meant an
adjustable height stem, and an adjustable reach stem, which further
narrowed the choices. At <$300 the two bikes it came down to were the
Trek Navigator 2.0, and the Schwinn Sierra GS, both of which had
suspension. The list of bikes that come in small enough sizes for 10-12
y.o.'s is very small as well. The Trek Navigator comes in 14.5", and the
Schwinn Sierra GS comes in "Small" which appears to be around 14". The
Muir Woods goes down to 13", which is the smallest I've seen for a 26"
wheeled bike.

The Bianchi Avenue "http://www.bianchiusa.com/07_avenue.html" is one
other good choice for a rigid frame.
"http://www.bianchiusa.com/07_avenue.html". I wish that it had an
adjustable reach stem, but that's something that could be added later if
needed.

[Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman]

Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> ...
> I went shopping last week for a bike for my 12 y.o. niece and there
> really was nothing in a rigid bike, at least not at the price most
> people are willing to pay for a bicycle that the kid will outgrow in two
> years. Complicating things were that her mother is a physical therapist,
> so proper posture on the bike was a requirement....

Easily done (pun intended) for $625 U.S., one a bike she will never
physically outgrow (unless she gets into the 99th percentile of
height).
See <http://www.easyracers.com/ez_1_sc.htm>.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[Doc]

On Jul 31, 3:52 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:

> Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's question
> IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the OP tells us where
> he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or more of us can recommend
> a good bike shop.


In the Orlando / Daytona Beach FL. vicinity


Btw, I appreciate the depth of the responses I'm seeing. Obviously a
pursuit with many enthusiastic participants.

[Art Harris]

Tim McNamara wrote:
> The answer to the OP's question
> IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> ought to be able to find a very suitable bike.
>
I agree. The problem is sticker shock. Most people who haven't bought
a bike in 30 years find it hard to accept that a decent entry-level
bike is going to cost $500. Especially when they see bikes for under
$100 that superficially look ok. It's even harder to swallow when
they're not sure they're going to stick with riding.

Art Harris

[A Muzi]

> frkrygow@gmail.com wrote:
>> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door like
>> that.

Tim McNamara wrote:
> Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's question
> IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the OP tells us where
> he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or more of us can recommend
> a good bike shop.

Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and ended
up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.

'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[landotter]

On Jul 31, 3:06 pm, Art Harris <n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Tim McNamara wrote:
> > The answer to the OP's question
> > IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> > ought to be able to find a very suitable bike.
>
> I agree. The problem is sticker shock. Most people who haven't bought
> a bike in 30 years find it hard to accept that a decent entry-level
> bike is going to cost $500.

That's only $125 in 1975 dollars. ;-) Good quality bikes are as cheap
as they've ever been. Compare an entry level Sora equipped $6-700 road
bike to a bike boom bike of the same cost when adjusted for inflation,
and the value is astounding.

[D_Frumious_B@ndersnat.ch]

In rec.bicycles.misc Art Harris <n2ah@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I agree. The problem is sticker shock. Most people who haven't bought
> a bike in 30 years find it hard to accept that a decent entry-level
> bike is going to cost $500. Especially when they see bikes for under
> $100 that superficially look ok. It's even harder to swallow when
> they're not sure they're going to stick with riding.

And there is the Catch-22. With a decent bike they might stick with
it, but the newby doesn't want to pay because s/he isn't sure...
OTOH, with a cheap junk bike, it's virtually a sure bet they won't
stick with it. Someone here once quoted a statistic that the average
DungMart bike travels only 75 miles before the rider gives up in disgust.
One exception to the cheap bike rule: I bought my
then-fifteen-year-old son Schwinn at Target. He has ridden it quite a
lot, which tells me he has the makings of a serious rider. Now he is
about to leave for college, taking it along. I do not expect the bike to
survive that experience, but I bought it with that in mind, as the
proverbial "beater."
When he graduates, I may just buy him a good bike as a present.

Bill

__o | Si hoc legere scis,
_`\(,_ | nimium eruditionis habes.
(_)/ (_) |

[Tim McNamara]

In article <13av7samap342d3@corp.supernews.com>,
A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

> > frkrygow@gmail.com wrote:
> >> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door
> >> like that.
>
> Tim McNamara wrote:
> > Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's
> > question IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop.
> > For $500 he ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the
> > OP tells us where he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or
> > more of us can recommend a good bike shop.
>
> Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and
> ended up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
>
> 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .

That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
a few very good ones. That was why I suggested that if the OP told us
where he lives, someone here might be able to steer him to a good shop.
I know where to send him in Madison and Minneapolis, though!

[me]

On Tue, 31 Jul 2007 15:46:19 -0500, A Muzi wrote:

>> frkrygow@gmail.com wrote:
>>> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door like
>>> that.
>
>
> Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and ended
> up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
>
> 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .


Halfords, is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a bike shop,
good or otherwise. Think Canadian Tire store, or even a vehicle
specific Walmart.

[Zoot Katz]

On Tue, 31 Jul 2007 15:46:19 -0500, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org>
wrote:

>'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .

Vancouver's bike biz seems to be doing well.

I know of four new shops that have opened here in the past year.

Another shop opened a second location and one of my favourite shops
expanded to include street biker fashions.

That three of these six shops cater to the fixed gear craze they
might not be around for long. The shop featuring sensible city bikes
may survive longer.

One shop that's been around forever had a "going out of business"
banner in their window two years ago. I think he changed his mind and
you'll now find his enthusiastic sons working in the store.

I've not kept count of the new shops offering electric bikes.
--
zk

[Scott Gordo]

On Jul 31, 5:46 pm, D_Frumiou...@ndersnat.ch wrote:
> In rec.bicycles.misc Art Harris <n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I agree. The problem is sticker shock. Most people who haven't bought
> > a bike in 30 years find it hard to accept that a decent entry-level
> > bike is going to cost $500. Especially when they see bikes for under
> > $100 that superficially look ok. It's even harder to swallow when
> > they're not sure they're going to stick with riding.
>
> And there is the Catch-22. With a decent bike they might stick with
> it, but the newby doesn't want to pay because s/he isn't sure...
> OTOH, with a cheap junk bike, it's virtually a sure bet they won't
> stick with it. Someone here once quoted a statistic that the average
> DungMart bike travels only 75 miles before the rider gives up in disgust.
> One exception to the cheap bike rule: I bought my
> then-fifteen-year-old son Schwinn at Target. He has ridden it quite a
> lot, which tells me he has the makings of a serious rider. Now he is
> about to leave for college, taking it along. I do not expect the bike to
> survive that experience, but I bought it with that in mind, as the
> proverbial "beater."
> When he graduates, I may just buy him a good bike as a present.
>
> Bill
>
> __o | Si hoc legere scis,
> _`\(,_ | nimium eruditionis habes.
> (_)/ (_) |

It probably doesn't hurt that you probably chose the bike based on
criteria other than the color and how many cool springs it has, and
that your maintenance skills are surely vastly superior to your
average purchaser. I think that the only tools my Dad owned when I
first started playing around with my BMX bike were a finish hammer and
a pipe wrench.

/s

[landotter]

On Jul 31, 5:27 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> In article <13av7samap34...@corp.supernews.com>,
> A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
> > > frkry...@gmail.com wrote:
> > >> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door
> > >> like that.
>
> > Tim McNamara wrote:
> > > Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's
> > > question IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop.
> > > For $500 he ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the
> > > OP tells us where he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or
> > > more of us can recommend a good bike shop.
>
> > Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and
> > ended up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
>
> > 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .
>
> That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
> a few very good ones.

I'm fortunate that a pretty nice one opened up three blocks from home.
Woohoo!

But across the river there are the incompetent ones. A guy I see out
and about on a very nice custom Waterford was tying down said bike in
his truck the other night, so I stopped to have a close up look. Those
Waterford guys can do a sweet fade! Very nice. I asked him why the new
Mavic low spoke count wheels, and he said he couldn't keep the old
ones true. 36H OPs on fancy hubs. 230# rider. A shop shouldn't be
called a shop if they can't build a simple set of 3X wheels that hold
up. BUT, they managed to use their incompetence and convince him that
it was his weight--and sold him a spendy set of Mavics. Crazy.

[SMS]

Tim McNamara wrote:

> That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
> a few very good ones. That was why I suggested that if the OP told us
> where he lives, someone here might be able to steer him to a good shop.
> I know where to send him in Madison and Minneapolis, though!

I see shops around me in decline. One wonderful shop, Bicycle Outfitter
in Los Altos, changed owners recently when the original owners retired.
I went in there a month or so ago, and the decline was astounding. Their
once wide selection of different brands was pretty much gone. They were
mostly Trek. I asked about some tires I wanted, that are one of Trek
brands, and the employee was rather rude. They wouldn't order them even
though they knew they existed. I understand that under the old
management the shop was not doing all that well, and maybe it was
because of too much inventory and too many sales. Yet the blue collar
shop nearby, Off Ramp, is happy to do special orders.

OTOH, REI and Performance have pretty wide selections these days, along
with good hours. The last two bikes I purchased for myself or helping
others were at Performance (a former Supergo) and at REI. Some people
diss Performance, but I've helped three people buy bikes there and
they've always been fine, with the bikes set up properly before they
went out the door.

The closest shop to me used to be a "legend," Spence Wolf's Cupertino
Bike Shop, but it isn't so great these days with the current owners.

[catzz66]

landotter wrote:
> On Jul 31, 3:06 pm, Art Harris <n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Tim McNamara wrote:
>>
>>>The answer to the OP's question
>>>IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
>>>ought to be able to find a very suitable bike.
>>
>>I agree. The problem is sticker shock. Most people who haven't bought
>>a bike in 30 years find it hard to accept that a decent entry-level
>>bike is going to cost $500.
>
>
> That's only $125 in 1975 dollars. ;-) Good quality bikes are as cheap
> as they've ever been. Compare an entry level Sora equipped $6-700 road
> bike to a bike boom bike of the same cost when adjusted for inflation,
> and the value is astounding.
>
>

That's what I was thinking. I remember buying a Murray department store
bike in the 70s for about $100 bucks. It wouldn't have come anywhere
close to the quality of a current day Specialized Sirrus hybrid or a
Trek 1000 road bike, to just name two. There are quite a few bikes in
that price range.

[Ozark Bicycle]

On Jul 31, 5:45 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 3:06 pm, Art Harris <n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Tim McNamara wrote:
> > > The answer to the OP's question
> > > IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> > > ought to be able to find a very suitable bike.
>
> > I agree. The problem is sticker shock. Most people who haven't bought
> > a bike in 30 years find it hard to accept that a decent entry-level
> > bike is going to cost $500.
>
> That's only $125 in 1975 dollars. ;-) Good quality bikes are as cheap
> as they've ever been. Compare an entry level Sora equipped $6-700 road
> bike to a bike boom bike of the same cost when adjusted for inflation,
> and the value is astounding.

How true! My first "quality bike" was a Motobecane Grand Touring,
purchased new for $225 in 1976. The WestEgg inflation calculator puts
that at $814 in "2006 dollars". A modern bike at that price would
embarass the Moto in every way, save for the aesthetics of the frame.

[Ozark Bicycle]

On Jul 31, 5:52 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 5:27 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > In article <13av7samap34...@corp.supernews.com>,
> > A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
> > > > frkry...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > >> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door
> > > >> like that.
>
> > > Tim McNamara wrote:
> > > > Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's
> > > > question IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop.
> > > > For $500 he ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the
> > > > OP tells us where he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or
> > > > more of us can recommend a good bike shop.
>
> > > Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and
> > > ended up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
>
> > > 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .
>
> > That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
> > a few very good ones.
>
> I'm fortunate that a pretty nice one opened up three blocks from home.
> Woohoo!
>
> But across the river there are the incompetent ones. A guy I see out
> and about on a very nice custom Waterford was tying down said bike in
> his truck the other night, so I stopped to have a close up look. Those
> Waterford guys can do a sweet fade! Very nice. I asked him why the new
> Mavic low spoke count wheels, and he said he couldn't keep the old
> ones true. 36H OPs on fancy hubs. 230# rider. A shop shouldn't be
> called a shop if they can't build a simple set of 3X wheels that hold
> up. BUT, they managed to use their incompetence and convince him that
> it was his weight--and sold him a spendy set of Mavics. Crazy.-

Crazy, yes, but this *is* the point that jim beam makes about the
quality of most LBS-built wheels v. the "pre-builts".

Of course, it will be interesting to see how the low spoke count
Mavics hold up under a 250+lb rider/bike package.

[max]

In article <46afc592$0$27217$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>,
SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> OTOH, REI and Performance have pretty wide selections these days, along
> with good hours.

I had an odd experience at the Fox Valley (Naperville, Rt. 59 + Aurora ave)
performance shop a couple months ago.

Went looking for cutesy* (color) non-folding 700 tires. I discovered that
half of their non-folding road bike tires were 27". Seriously, half of
them. And they were all jumbled in with teh 700 tires.

It was a ****ing mess in the tire corner. I later discovered i'd gone in a
couple of days after a big advertised sale, so maybe that had something to
do w/ it.


..max
*such as the late, lamented Vittoria Courier TT 700x23 kevlar, a cute and
incredibly durable slick that came in colors which matched my eyes. I got
3000 commuting miles out of a pair w/o a single flat.

[Bill Sornson]

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman wrote:

> What's wrong with upside down brake levers? They work fine for me:
> <http://www.ihpva.org/incoming/2002/Dragonflyer/df4.jpg>. ;)

Got a handicapped sticker for that contraption?

[frkrygow@gmail.com]

On Jul 31, 9:59 pm, Doc <docsavag...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 3:52 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>
> > Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's question
> > IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> > ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the OP tells us where
> > he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or more of us can recommend
> > a good bike shop.
>
> In the Orlando / Daytona Beach FL. vicinity

If your in Florida, you probably don't need the low gears I
mentioned. Your biggest hill is probably going to be the one they
built to get over a freeway.

But I still recommend a non-suspended mountain bike. The main reason
is that its wheels will be strong enough for perfect reliability
despite your weight. (Rear wheel spokes are a weak point on many
bikes.)

You might find shops pushing you toward a "hybrid" or a "comfort bike"
that uses 26" mountain bike wheel size, but it will come polluted with
springs at various places, and they are NOT an advantage for any
riding you're likely to do.

> Btw, I appreciate the depth of the responses I'm seeing. Obviously a
> pursuit with many enthusiastic participants.

Trust us, cycling is a beautiful thing!

- Frank Krygowski

[SMS]

Doc wrote:
> On Jul 31, 3:52 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>
>> Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's question
>> IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
>> ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the OP tells us where
>> he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or more of us can recommend
>> a good bike shop.
>
>
> In the Orlando / Daytona Beach FL. vicinity
>
>
> Btw, I appreciate the depth of the responses I'm seeing. Obviously a
> pursuit with many enthusiastic participants.

Be sure to get sufficiently low gearing, given your location. Some of
the best recreational rides in that area are north of Orlando, around
the Mount Dora area. If you've never climbed Mount Dora on a bicycle,
you don't know what you're missing. Since much of Florida is flat, I
think that some shops may be pushing bicycles without the third
chainring (granny gear), so be careful. I lived in Gainesville, and some
of the best rides were out in the hills around there.

You'd be fine with a Cro-Mo steel touring bicycle or steel cross
bicycle. It'll have stronger wheels and a stronger frame than other road
bicycles.

$350 Bianchi Avenue

$600 Windsor Tourist
("http://bikesdirect.com/products/windsor/tourist.htm"). Get it tuned
and assembled at a shop.

$800 Novara Randonee (it's $800 after the REI 10% rebate, plus 5% if you
get an REI Visa card, also they often put all Novara bikes on sale for
20% off).

$1000 Surly LHT

[landotter]

On Jul 31, 9:24 pm, Ozark Bicycle
<bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 5:52 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 31, 5:27 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>
> > > In article <13av7samap34...@corp.supernews.com>,
> > > A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > frkry...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > >> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door
> > > > >> like that.
>
> > > > Tim McNamara wrote:
> > > > > Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's
> > > > > question IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop.
> > > > > For $500 he ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the
> > > > > OP tells us where he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or
> > > > > more of us can recommend a good bike shop.
>
> > > > Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and
> > > > ended up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
>
> > > > 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .
>
> > > That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
> > > a few very good ones.
>
> > I'm fortunate that a pretty nice one opened up three blocks from home.
> > Woohoo!
>
> > But across the river there are the incompetent ones. A guy I see out
> > and about on a very nice custom Waterford was tying down said bike in
> > his truck the other night, so I stopped to have a close up look. Those
> > Waterford guys can do a sweet fade! Very nice. I asked him why the new
> > Mavic low spoke count wheels, and he said he couldn't keep the old
> > ones true. 36H OPs on fancy hubs. 230# rider. A shop shouldn't be
> > called a shop if they can't build a simple set of 3X wheels that hold
> > up. BUT, they managed to use their incompetence and convince him that
> > it was his weight--and sold him a spendy set of Mavics. Crazy.-
>
> Crazy, yes, but this *is* the point that jim beam makes about the
> quality of most LBS-built wheels v. the "pre-builts".

Well, the local shops apparently can't properly tension a prebuilt
either. This evening I was flagged down by a guy whose son's flat I
fixed the other night. Dad had only brought a spare tube and punctured
it during install. I whupped out my Remas and fixed them up. I'd left
a lever in the grass and the dad had been carrying it around for over
a week. That's just plain nice.

At any rate, we took to talking and I manage to hook my shoelace onto
my spd pedal and fall into him, my bartape being removed like steamed
geoduck skin, and me throwing his wheel out of true by 3mm. All very
funny. I had him follow me home, so I could either true his wheel, or
swap him for something true, as I had to make it right. I slipped his
wheel into my "stand", got the mild bit I'd put in there out with a
few half turns. Then I got out some other lumps and bumps. I asked him
if he'd taken it in to shop X and he said, "yeah, twice." Well, there
were non-drive side spokes that were totally slack, and the spokes
were loose overall. I evened out the obvious stuff, and give him a
1/4+ turn tighten all around. I'd have liked to have brought it up
more, but the sun was setting. Maybe I'll carry a spoke wrench around
till I see him again and get that wheel really happy.

[jim beam]

landotter wrote:
> On Jul 31, 9:24 pm, Ozark Bicycle
> <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 31, 5:52 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Jul 31, 5:27 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>>>> In article <13av7samap34...@corp.supernews.com>,
>>>> A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>>> frkry...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door
>>>>>>> like that.
>>>>> Tim McNamara wrote:
>>>>>> Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's
>>>>>> question IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop.
>>>>>> For $500 he ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the
>>>>>> OP tells us where he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or
>>>>>> more of us can recommend a good bike shop.
>>>>> Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and
>>>>> ended up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
>>>>> 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .
>>>> That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
>>>> a few very good ones.
>>> I'm fortunate that a pretty nice one opened up three blocks from home.
>>> Woohoo!
>>> But across the river there are the incompetent ones. A guy I see out
>>> and about on a very nice custom Waterford was tying down said bike in
>>> his truck the other night, so I stopped to have a close up look. Those
>>> Waterford guys can do a sweet fade! Very nice. I asked him why the new
>>> Mavic low spoke count wheels, and he said he couldn't keep the old
>>> ones true. 36H OPs on fancy hubs. 230# rider. A shop shouldn't be
>>> called a shop if they can't build a simple set of 3X wheels that hold
>>> up. BUT, they managed to use their incompetence and convince him that
>>> it was his weight--and sold him a spendy set of Mavics. Crazy.-
>> Crazy, yes, but this *is* the point that jim beam makes about the
>> quality of most LBS-built wheels v. the "pre-builts".
>
> Well, the local shops apparently can't properly tension a prebuilt
> either.

isn't that the point? in my experience, pre-built's that have been
"helped" by the local shop are usually awful. out of the box, they're
true, evenly tensioned, and highly reliable. i say don't let the local
wheel jockey /near/ your wheels unless you're absolutely certain they
know their business. and not many do.


> This evening I was flagged down by a guy whose son's flat I
> fixed the other night. Dad had only brought a spare tube and punctured
> it during install. I whupped out my Remas and fixed them up. I'd left
> a lever in the grass and the dad had been carrying it around for over
> a week. That's just plain nice.
>
> At any rate, we took to talking and I manage to hook my shoelace onto
> my spd pedal and fall into him, my bartape being removed like steamed
> geoduck skin, and me throwing his wheel out of true by 3mm. All very
> funny. I had him follow me home, so I could either true his wheel, or
> swap him for something true, as I had to make it right. I slipped his
> wheel into my "stand", got the mild bit I'd put in there out with a
> few half turns. Then I got out some other lumps and bumps. I asked him
> if he'd taken it in to shop X and he said, "yeah, twice." Well, there
> were non-drive side spokes that were totally slack, and the spokes
> were loose overall. I evened out the obvious stuff, and give him a
> 1/4+ turn tighten all around. I'd have liked to have brought it up
> more, but the sun was setting. Maybe I'll carry a spoke wrench around
> till I see him again and get that wheel really happy.
>

[landotter]

On Jul 31, 10:13 pm, jim beam <spamvor...@bad.example.net> wrote:
> landotter wrote:
> > On Jul 31, 9:24 pm, Ozark Bicycle
> > <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote:
> >> On Jul 31, 5:52 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> On Jul 31, 5:27 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> >>>> In article <13av7samap34...@corp.supernews.com>,
> >>>> A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
> >>>>>> frkry...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>>>>> A decent bike shop would have never let that bike out the door
> >>>>>>> like that.
> >>>>> Tim McNamara wrote:
> >>>>>> Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's
> >>>>>> question IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop.
> >>>>>> For $500 he ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the
> >>>>>> OP tells us where he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or
> >>>>>> more of us can recommend a good bike shop.
> >>>>> Then the other poster today who bought a Raleigh at Halford's and
> >>>>> ended up with junk due to poor prep, poor service, hostile attitude.
> >>>>> 'a good bike shop' is not on every corner nowadays . . .
> >>>> That, sadly, is quite true. There are some idiot bike shops locally and
> >>>> a few very good ones.
> >>> I'm fortunate that a pretty nice one opened up three blocks from home.
> >>> Woohoo!
> >>> But across the river there are the incompetent ones. A guy I see out
> >>> and about on a very nice custom Waterford was tying down said bike in
> >>> his truck the other night, so I stopped to have a close up look. Those
> >>> Waterford guys can do a sweet fade! Very nice. I asked him why the new
> >>> Mavic low spoke count wheels, and he said he couldn't keep the old
> >>> ones true. 36H OPs on fancy hubs. 230# rider. A shop shouldn't be
> >>> called a shop if they can't build a simple set of 3X wheels that hold
> >>> up. BUT, they managed to use their incompetence and convince him that
> >>> it was his weight--and sold him a spendy set of Mavics. Crazy.-
> >> Crazy, yes, but this *is* the point that jim beam makes about the
> >> quality of most LBS-built wheels v. the "pre-builts".
>
> > Well, the local shops apparently can't properly tension a prebuilt
> > either.
>
> isn't that the point? in my experience, pre-built's that have been
> "helped" by the local shop are usually awful. out of the box, they're
> true, evenly tensioned, and highly reliable. i say don't let the local
> wheel jockey /near/ your wheels unless you're absolutely certain they
> know their business. and not many do.
>

Nah, the point is that it's not *hard* to tension up a wheel
reasonably evenly by ear in less than ten minutes and the bike squids
at the shop were lazy. A pre-built, that is. I removed the warp I put
in the fellow's wheel in less than three, while conversatin' and spent
a few more evening out a few obvious tension disparities to be
neighborly.

[Nate Knutson]

On Aug 1, 6:39 am, Peter Cole <peter_c...@comcast.net> wrote:
> Doc wrote:
> > Obviously construction quality isn't a small issue.
>
> > So, what are some things to look for that you feel are minimum for a
> > bike? I don't want to spend a fortune, but don't want to have the
> > thing come apart on me, brakes fail, some crucial piece that should
> > never break disintegrate. I'm 6'3" 260-ish lbs so need something
> > that's going to take the weight while it's helping me to shed some of
> > it. ;-)
>
> > I'm looking mainly for something I can take down the road but will
> > handle a fair share of knocks too, if I need to jump up onto the
> > sidewalk, encounter uneven pavement sections, rough sections, run
> > across dirt/grass/sand/gravel etc. Stuff you're going to encounter in
> > the real world.
>
> At your size you are kind of pushing the envelope on entry level bikes.
> For what you want to do you might be OK on a $250-300 bike store bought
> hybrid or mountain bike. Of course you can spend more than that but you
> wouldn't necessarily get better durability.

He absolutely won't be okay with those bikes, as they've virtually all
got freewheel hubs.

[D_Frumious_B@ndersnat.ch]

In rec.bicycles.misc Peter Cole <peter_cole@comcast.net> wrote:
<SNIP>
> At your size you are kind of pushing the envelope on entry level bikes.
> For what you want to do you might be OK on a $250-300 bike store bought
> hybrid or mountain bike. Of course you can spend more than that but you
> wouldn't necessarily get better durability.

> At roughly your size, the problems I've had with components have been:
> wheels, bottom brackets (bearing/axle assembly for cranks) and pedals. I
> would upgrade the pedals, make sure the bike shop knows how to set up
> the wheels (adjust tension & stress relieve) or learn to do it myself,
> and just replace the other components with better stuff if/once they fail.

> If you use off-road stuff for the road you get some safety margin for
> overloading. Using that strategy you might want to go with a MTB set up
> with narrow, smooth tires -- essentially a hybrid.

Smooth, narrow tires are swell on smooth, clean pavement. Also the way
to go if (like many on this ng) you value speed. OTOH, if you ever ride
dirt roads, trails, or even newly graveled streets (of which I had one
take me by surprise early this morning), you might wish for some tread.
The compromise I've hit on is a tire made by Specialized that has a
smooth strip down the center. Riding straight on a smooth road the bike
practically floats along. But in mud, snow, gravel, or simply when I bank
the bike over for a tight turn, I can hear the buzz as the lugs grab the
pavement.
Incidentally for the OP, I'm almost your size. My commuter bike is a
21" frame size Specialized HR hardtail, about $400 new at a local bike &
ski shop. After five years of almost daily use and around 10,000 miles,
I've replaced seat, rear wheel, pedals, chain, all the gears, and inner
tubes, the latter two or three times. But I'm only on my second set of
tires.
Kevlar - love it.

Bill

__o | Harry: How could a troll get in?
_`\(,_ | Ron: Not on its own. Trolls are really stupid.
(_)/ (_) |

[landotter]

On Aug 1, 11:32 am, Hank Wirtz <h...@wirtznet.net> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 11:47 am, Scott Gordo <blubberp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I've seen this bike in my LBS, MSRP $285:http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/07_bikes/commuter1.html
> > It's nice and looks pretty durable, though people aren't crazy about
> > the moustache handlebars and those adjustable stems kinda suck but
> > they'll give you a comfortable riding position before you swap it out
> > for a regular welded stem.
>
> North Road, AKA Nitto Dove Bars are DA BOMB. I've got a set on my
> cruiser, and they are astoundingly comfortable. Wrap the front
> sections, and you can grab them as another grip position, or rest your
> forearms in the curves for a headwind position that still lets you
> steer (which you can't do as well with a wider cruiser bar, like an
> Albatross). Those, plus a Nexus8 hub made my old '85 Peugeot Orient
> Express MTB fun to ride again.

Indeed, that Jamis looks to be a very sensible bike. A wide range 7spd
rear only setup is stupidly simple to own and operate. The bars are a
mixed blessing. I ride such bars on my classic Raleigh every day on
short trips to the post office or to the beer emporium. With Ritchey
True-Grips, you can't get much more natural comfort while seated.
However, they aren't the thing for aggressive out of the saddle
riding. 'Bars are cheap enough to swap out if ya don't like 'em, so
not a big deal. I had a bike with a Nexus hub where I constantly
switched between flat and North Road bars and couldn't make up my
mind. The flat bars were fantastic for aggro riding, and awful for
distance, the NR bars were the converse.

[Scott Gordo]

On Aug 1, 12:32 pm, Hank Wirtz <h...@wirtznet.net> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 11:47 am, Scott Gordo <blubberp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I've seen this bike in my LBS, MSRP $285:http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/07_bikes/commuter1.html
> > It's nice and looks pretty durable, though people aren't crazy about
> > the moustache handlebars and those adjustable stems kinda suck but
> > they'll give you a comfortable riding position before you swap it out
> > for a regular welded stem.
>
> North Road, AKA Nitto Dove Bars are DA BOMB. I've got a set on my
> cruiser, and they are astoundingly comfortable. Wrap the front
> sections, and you can grab them as another grip position, or rest your
> forearms in the curves for a headwind position that still lets you
> steer (which you can't do as well with a wider cruiser bar, like an
> Albatross). Those, plus a Nexus8 hub made my old '85 Peugeot Orient
> Express MTB fun to ride again.

They're so good, the put Bridgestone out of business....

Just kidding. But the shop that sells the Jamis removes so many of the
"North Road" bars they gave me a couple of them. I've installed one on
an old fixie, the drop bars of which were seriously drooped.

They're not bad, but not as comfortable as drops for me. I find the
flats, hoods, and drops more comfy, but that's me. They do look cool
though, which is good because I'm going to try and sell it.

/s

[frkrygow@gmail.com]

On Aug 1, 1:05 pm, SMS <scharf.ste...@geemail.com> wrote:
> Doc wrote:
> > On Jul 31, 3:52 pm, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>
> >> Dingdingdingding! We have a winner. The answer to the OP's question
> >> IMHO is to buy a reputable brand bike at a good bike shop. For $500 he
> >> ought to be able to find a very suitable bike. If the OP tells us where
> >> he lives, the odds are pretty good that one or more of us can recommend
> >> a good bike shop.
>
> > In the Orlando / Daytona Beach FL. vicinity
>
> > Btw, I appreciate the depth of the responses I'm seeing. Obviously a
> > pursuit with many enthusiastic participants.
>
> Be sure to get sufficiently low gearing, given your location. Some of
> the best recreational rides in that area are north of Orlando, around
> the Mount Dora area. If you've never climbed Mount Dora on a bicycle,
> you don't know what you're missing. Since much of Florida is flat, I
> think that some shops may be pushing bicycles without the third
> chainring (granny gear), so be careful. I lived in Gainesville, and some
> of the best rides were out in the hills around there.

OK, I've visited Florida but never lived there - but I don't recall
ever seeing anything I'd call a "hill." The highest point in the
state is less than 400 feet above sea level!

What percent grades are there around Orlando and Daytona Beach? How
long and how high are the hills?

And what gearing would be needed for them?

- Frank Krygowski

[landotter]

On Aug 1, 1:32 pm, Scott Gordo <blubberp...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Just kidding. But the shop that sells the Jamis removes so many of the
> "North Road" bars they gave me a couple of them.

Despite their limitations, I'd betcha the vast majority of such swaps
were fashion motivated.