SPD "M" Cleats

[Andrew Price]

Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
appears no longer to be sold)

[Crescentius Vespasianus]

Andrew Price wrote:
> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
> appears no longer to be sold)
----------
I've tried the newer one on an older
shimano spd pedal and really didn't see
any difference.

[jim beam]

Andrew Price wrote:
> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
> appears no longer to be sold)

don't even bother with them - just use the standard "single" release
cleats. easier to operate. more secure.

[dustoyevsky@mac.com]

On Oct 24, 12:16 pm, Andrew Price <ajpr...@free.fr> wrote:
> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
> appears no longer to be sold)

http://www.qbike.com/cgi-bin/find.cgi?ord=p&st=sh55&auct=on


http://tinyurl.com/33y45p


Apparently, the OP may purchase for use as he desires.

If the 51's are OOP, it might be time to stock up-- I've only used
these in Spin class, but from that experience, I don't think I'd want
something that clicks out easier (or in more positions/directions/
whatever) for use on a moving bicycle.

Just my imbicilic, moronic, bull****, goddamn, idiotic, fraudulent,
chicken little ****tard*, un-medicated, D-y boy opinion, of course;
"YMMV".

*I kinda liked that one!

--D-y

[Jambo]

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:DoqdnTXeWKiel73anZ2dnUVZ_uzinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
> Andrew Price wrote:
>> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
>> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
>> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
>> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
>> appears no longer to be sold)
>
> don't even bother with them - just use the standard "single" release
> cleats. easier to operate. more secure.

Bull****. "Easier to operate"? Yeah, clicking any of them in is such a big
ordeal.

"More secure"? Sure, since the release springs are not adjustable - oh
wait, they are.

[jim beam]

Jambo wrote:
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:DoqdnTXeWKiel73anZ2dnUVZ_uzinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>> Andrew Price wrote:
>>> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
>>> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
>>> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
>>> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
>>> appears no longer to be sold)
>> don't even bother with them - just use the standard "single" release
>> cleats. easier to operate. more secure.
>
> Bull****. "Easier to operate"? Yeah, clicking any of them in is such a big
> ordeal.
>
> "More secure"? Sure, since the release springs are not adjustable - oh
> wait, they are.
>
>

er,

1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
correspondingly "easier to operate".

2. they release in two modes, not one. sh51's release in only one mode
and are therefore more secure, especially as it's at 90 degrees to
pedaling force, not just 45 like the others. that means "more secure".

goddamned moron.

[Jambo]

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:H_CdnXB7G-CWw7zanZ2dnUVZ_hmtnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
> Jambo wrote:
>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>> news:DoqdnTXeWKiel73anZ2dnUVZ_uzinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>> Andrew Price wrote:
>>>> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
>>>> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
>>>> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
>>>> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
>>>> appears no longer to be sold)
>>> don't even bother with them - just use the standard "single" release
>>> cleats. easier to operate. more secure.
>>
>> Bull****. "Easier to operate"? Yeah, clicking any of them in is such a
>> big ordeal.
>>
>> "More secure"? Sure, since the release springs are not adjustable - oh
>> wait, they are.
> er,
>
> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
> correspondingly "easier to operate".

"Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy. Metal that binds in the pedal?
What, they're molten or something? ****ing idiot.

> 2. they release in two modes, not one. sh51's release in only one mode
> and are therefore more secure, especially as it's at 90 degrees to
> pedaling force, not just 45 like the others. that means "more secure".

Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you can
unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.

And just where do you get "90 degrees at pedaling force", imbecile? SPDs
unclip at 15 degrees twist, either both ways or just one. That adds up to
either 15 or 30 degrees. Idiot.

> goddamned moron.

****ing imbecilic fraud.

[jim beam]

Jambo wrote:
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:H_CdnXB7G-CWw7zanZ2dnUVZ_hmtnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>> Jambo wrote:
>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>> news:DoqdnTXeWKiel73anZ2dnUVZ_uzinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>>> Andrew Price wrote:
>>>>> Does anyone know the difference between the Shimano SPD SH55 and SH56
>>>>> cleats? Both are "multiple exit", but the shape is slightly
>>>>> different, and the SH56 seem to release more readily on the same pedal
>>>>> release settings. Just two generations of the same product? (the SH55
>>>>> appears no longer to be sold)
>>>> don't even bother with them - just use the standard "single" release
>>>> cleats. easier to operate. more secure.
>>> Bull****. "Easier to operate"? Yeah, clicking any of them in is such a
>>> big ordeal.
>>>
>>> "More secure"? Sure, since the release springs are not adjustable - oh
>>> wait, they are.
>> er,
>>
>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
>> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
>> correspondingly "easier to operate".
>
> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.

er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your homework.


> Metal that binds in the pedal?

galling. do your homework.


> What, they're molten or something? ****ing idiot.
>
>> 2. they release in two modes, not one. sh51's release in only one mode
>> and are therefore more secure, especially as it's at 90 degrees to
>> pedaling force, not just 45 like the others. that means "more secure".
>
> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you can
> unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.
>
> And just where do you get "90 degrees at pedaling force", imbecile? SPDs
> unclip at 15 degrees twist, either both ways or just one. That adds up to
> either 15 or 30 degrees. Idiot.

buy the cleats and do your homework. moron.


>
>> goddamned moron.
>
> ****ing imbecilic fraud.
>
>

you're losing it jambo. time for the meds again.

[SocSecTrainWreck@earthlink.net]

Jambo wrote:
> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you can
> unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.

Although I use SPDs, I don't know much about the technicalities of
this "discussion", having never really got beyond tightening the
release force; however, I can tell you one thing: staying clipped in
on a mountain bike is not about how spastic you are while pedaling,
it's about staying attached to your bike and maintaining control while
you are flying, bumping, jumping and twisting. The forces on the
pedals come from a lot of different directions.

[Jambo]

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
> Jambo wrote:

>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
>>> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
>>> correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>
>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>
> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your homework.

Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer" than sh51.

Don't anyone hold their breath though, lying tard.

>> Metal that binds in the pedal?
>
> galling. do your homework.

Yeah, cleats suffer from galling all the time. Strange that no one reports
that in any fora, chicken little ****tard.

>>> 2. they release in two modes, not one. sh51's release in only one mode
>>> and are therefore more secure, especially as it's at 90 degrees to
>>> pedaling force, not just 45 like the others. that means "more secure".
>>
>> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
>> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
>> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you
>> can unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.
>>
>> And just where do you get "90 degrees at pedaling force", imbecile? SPDs
>> unclip at 15 degrees twist, either both ways or just one. That adds up
>> to either 15 or 30 degrees. Idiot.
>
> buy the cleats and do your homework. moron.

Eh, I use them all the time, idiot. Answer the question, just where do you
get "90 degrees at pedaling force", imbecile?

>>
>>> goddamned moron.
>>
>> ****ing imbecilic fraud.
> you're losing it jambo. time for the meds again.

Sure, beamtard. Caught out bull****ting again, and you just keep on keepin'
on.

[Tom Sherman]

"jim beam" wrote:
> Jambo wrote:
>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>
>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
>>> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
>>> correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>
>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>
> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your homework....

Has this been tested? (If I had access to a hardness tester, I would do
so, as the test only takes a few seconds).

For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M" SPuDs,
but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.

I have not had much experience with mud affecting SPuD operation with
the different cleats, as local trails are not to be ridden when wet (and
rightfully so).

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
When did ignorance of biology become a "family value"?

[jim beam]

Jambo wrote:
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>> Jambo wrote:
>
>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
>>>> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
>>>> correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your homework.
>
> Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer" than sh51.

you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats, then
do some hardness testing. prove me wrong.



>
> Don't anyone hold their breath though, lying tard.
>
>>> Metal that binds in the pedal?
>> galling. do your homework.
>
> Yeah, cleats suffer from galling all the time.

you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats, then
do some wear/unclip resistance testing. prove me wrong.


> Strange that no one reports
> that in any fora, chicken little ****tard.
>
>>>> 2. they release in two modes, not one. sh51's release in only one mode
>>>> and are therefore more secure, especially as it's at 90 degrees to
>>>> pedaling force, not just 45 like the others. that means "more secure".
>>> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
>>> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
>>> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you
>>> can unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.
>>>
>>> And just where do you get "90 degrees at pedaling force", imbecile? SPDs
>>> unclip at 15 degrees twist, either both ways or just one. That adds up
>>> to either 15 or 30 degrees. Idiot.
>> buy the cleats and do your homework. moron.
>
> Eh, I use them all the time, idiot. Answer the question, just where do you
> get "90 degrees at pedaling force", imbecile?

seems you're not too good at geometry! but you're a moron, so no news
there.


>
>>>> goddamned moron.
>>> ****ing imbecilic fraud.
>> you're losing it jambo. time for the meds again.
>
> Sure, beamtard. Caught out bull****ting again, and you just keep on keepin'
> on.
>
>

[Bill Sornson]

jim beam wrote:
> Jambo wrote:
>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>> news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>>> Jambo wrote:
>>
>>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the
>>>>> pedal, especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51
>>>>> cleats are correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
>>> homework.
>>
>> Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer"
>> than sh51.
>
> you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats,
> then do some hardness testing. prove me wrong.


Quick anecdote: when I used SPD pedals and cleats for mountain biking
(since switched to Eggbeaters -- now those are some REALLY soft cleats
{brass IINM}), I could tell a definite difference between the "single
release" and "multi release" cleats. The former gave a nice, firm CLICK
when engaged and disengaged; the latter felt mushy when clicking in and out.

I didn't investigate to see whether it was a design difference or actual
hardness qualities, but the cleats were quite (and unmistakenly) distinct.

Bill "two cents please" S.

[Art Harris]

dustoyev...@mac.com wrote:
>
> If the 51's are OOP, it might be time to stock up-- I've only used
> these in Spin class, but from that experience, I don't think I'd want
> something that clicks out easier (or in more positions/directions/
> whatever) for use on a moving bicycle.

I doubt that the single-release SH-51 is going away. The multi-release
SH-55 is being replaced by the SH-56.

Art Harris

[jim beam]

Bill Sornson wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
>> Jambo wrote:
>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>> news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>>>> Jambo wrote:
>>>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the
>>>>>> pedal, especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51
>>>>>> cleats are correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>>>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
>>>> homework.
>>> Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer"
>>> than sh51.
>> you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats,
>> then do some hardness testing. prove me wrong.
>
>
> Quick anecdote: when I used SPD pedals and cleats for mountain biking
> (since switched to Eggbeaters -- now those are some REALLY soft cleats
> {brass IINM}), I could tell a definite difference between the "single
> release" and "multi release" cleats. The former gave a nice, firm CLICK
> when engaged and disengaged; the latter felt mushy when clicking in and out.
>
> I didn't investigate to see whether it was a design difference or actual
> hardness qualities, but the cleats were quite (and unmistakenly) distinct.

thank you, but too late for this week's session. moron gets sedated
sometime on thursday evenings, and is kept under until tuesdays.

[Scott Gordo]

On Oct 26, 12:36 pm, "Bill Sornson" <as...@ask.me> wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
> > Jambo wrote:
> >> "jim beam" <spamvor...@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> >>news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
> >>> Jambo wrote:
>
> >>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the
> >>>>> pedal, especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51
> >>>>> cleats are correspondingly "easier to operate".
> >>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
> >>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
> >>> homework.
>
> >> Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer"
> >> than sh51.
>
> > you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats,
> > then do some hardness testing. prove me wrong.
>
> Quick anecdote: when I used SPD pedals and cleats for mountain biking
> (since switched to Eggbeaters -- now those are some REALLY soft cleats
> {brass IINM}), I could tell a definite difference between the "single
> release" and "multi release" cleats. The former gave a nice, firm CLICK
> when engaged and disengaged; the latter felt mushy when clicking in and out.
>
> I didn't investigate to see whether it was a design difference or actual
> hardness qualities, but the cleats were quite (and unmistakenly) distinct.
>
> Bill "two cents please" S.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Same "mushy" thing with my Time Alium pedal's brass cleat. The cleat's
face wears down from strolling on them, but I haven't experienced much
of an issue with clipping in.

No reassuring click, but, in my experience with the old 747s, less
likelyhood of popping out accidentally. Though I have little idea what
spring tension I'm running and I'm not overly fastidious about
replacing my SPD cleats until it's beyond necessary.

Anyway, back to the OP, I'm using SH51s with my 747s, which work
great. I had a different replacement cleat before this set, and they
just didn't want to work. Different shape. I still have them at home
somwhere, I'll see if I can find their design info....

Hey, you wanted two cents....

/s

[Peter Cole]

Bill Sornson wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
>> Jambo wrote:
>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>> news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>>>> Jambo wrote:
>>>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the
>>>>>> pedal, especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51
>>>>>> cleats are correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>>>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
>>>> homework.
>>> Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer"
>>> than sh51.
>> you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats,
>> then do some hardness testing. prove me wrong.
>
>
> Quick anecdote: when I used SPD pedals and cleats for mountain biking
> (since switched to Eggbeaters -- now those are some REALLY soft cleats
> {brass IINM}), I could tell a definite difference between the "single
> release" and "multi release" cleats. The former gave a nice, firm CLICK
> when engaged and disengaged; the latter felt mushy when clicking in and out.
>
> I didn't investigate to see whether it was a design difference or actual
> hardness qualities, but the cleats were quite (and unmistakenly) distinct.

The only difference was the shape of the "nose" and the color. In some
circles, the single-release were known as "the black cleats of death".

[Peter Cole]

SocSecTrainWreck@earthlink.net wrote:
> Jambo wrote:
>> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
>> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
>> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you can
>> unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.
>
> Although I use SPDs, I don't know much about the technicalities of
> this "discussion", having never really got beyond tightening the
> release force; however, I can tell you one thing: staying clipped in
> on a mountain bike is not about how spastic you are while pedaling,
> it's about staying attached to your bike and maintaining control while
> you are flying, bumping, jumping and twisting. The forces on the
> pedals come from a lot of different directions.
>

Yea, but if you watch BMX'ers do the same (& worse) they just use plain
pedals.

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M" SPuDs,
> but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.

Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do not buy)
list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became unexpectedly
disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats). I doubt it's a bit
issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that much energy into the
cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by including them in their
models which have SPD only on one side, with a standard pedal platform on
the other) is in sync with that.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ffvamc$kdk$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> "jim beam" wrote:
>> Jambo wrote:
>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
>>>> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
>>>> correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>>
>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>>
>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
>> homework....
>
> Has this been tested? (If I had access to a hardness tester, I would do
> so, as the test only takes a few seconds).
>
> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M" SPuDs,
> but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>
> I have not had much experience with mud affecting SPuD operation with the
> different cleats, as local trails are not to be ridden when wet (and
> rightfully so).
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> When did ignorance of biology become a "family value"?

[Fritz]

On Sun, 28 Oct 2007 19:41:42 -0700, "Mike Jacoubowsky"
<mikej1@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M" SPuDs,
>> but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>
>Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do not buy)
>list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became unexpectedly
>disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats). I doubt it's a bit
>issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that much energy into the
>cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by including them in their
>models which have SPD only on one side, with a standard pedal platform on
>the other) is in sync with that.
>
>--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
>www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>
>
>"Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:ffvamc$kdk$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>> "jim beam" wrote:
>>> Jambo wrote:
>>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the pedal,
>>>>> especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51 cleats are
>>>>> correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>>>
>>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>>>
>>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
>>> homework....
>>
>> Has this been tested? (If I had access to a hardness tester, I would do
>> so, as the test only takes a few seconds).
>>
>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M" SPuDs,
>> but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>>
>> I have not had much experience with mud affecting SPuD operation with the
>> different cleats, as local trails are not to be ridden when wet (and
>> rightfully so).
>>
>> --
>> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
>> When did ignorance of biology become a "family value"?
>


I ride on Nashbar mountain bike pedals (made by Wellgo) for years and
they have been, up till last year been a multi release type of pedal.
You could twist your foot left of right and disengage or you could
tilt you foot outward and release. This last type of release ( the
outward tilt one) cost me a painful spill last year. I am now
riding the newer version that is single release and the pedal is MUCH
more secure.

[Andrew Price]

On Sun, 28 Oct 2007 19:41:42 -0700, "Mike Jacoubowsky"
<mikej1@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do not buy)
>list.

I don't think you could buy it now, even if you wanted to - it appears
to have been replaced by the SH-56.

>People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became unexpectedly
>disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats).

And the SH-56 seems to release even more easily than its predecessor.

>I doubt it's a bit
>issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that much energy into the
>cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by including them in their
>models which have SPD only on one side, with a standard pedal platform on
>the other) is in sync with that.

There is a certain logic in that - I used them on a "hack" bike in a
stop-go urban environment, and before the standard twist release
became second nature, the multi-release saved me from two or three
spills. At the same time, I had begun to use Look pedals on a road
bike, and there, before the release motion became instinctive, I did
have the traditional fall and associated bruised ego.

[Peter Cole]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M" SPuDs,
>> but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>
> Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do not buy)
> list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became unexpectedly
> disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats). I doubt it's a bit
> issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that much energy into the
> cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by including them in their
> models which have SPD only on one side, with a standard pedal platform on
> the other) is in sync with that.

The SH-55 is all I use on all my bikes (road & off-road). I much prefer
them to the single-release version. I've never had a problem, they've
always disengaged when needed and not otherwise.

[Art Harris]

Fritz wrote:
> I ride on Nashbar mountain bike pedals (made by Wellgo) for years and
> they have been, up till last year been a multi release type of pedal.
> You could twist your foot left of right and disengage or you could
> tilt you foot outward and release. This last type of release ( the
> outward tilt one) cost me a painful spill last year. I am now
> riding the newer version that is single release and the pedal is MUCH
> more secure.

If these are similar to Shimano SPD pedals, it's the cleat (not the
pedal) that determines whether there is single or multiple modes of
release.

Art Harris

[Tom Sherman]

Peter Cole wrote:
> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M"
>>> SPuDs, but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>>
>> Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do
>> not buy) list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became
>> unexpectedly disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats). I
>> doubt it's a bit issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that
>> much energy into the cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by
>> including them in their models which have SPD only on one side, with a
>> standard pedal platform on the other) is in sync with that.
>
> The SH-55 is all I use on all my bikes (road & off-road). I much prefer
> them to the single-release version. I've never had a problem, they've
> always disengaged when needed and not otherwise.

Do you have the release tension set very high?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
When did ignorance of biology become a "family value"?

[Peter Cole]

Art Harris wrote:
> Fritz wrote:
>> I ride on Nashbar mountain bike pedals (made by Wellgo) for years and
>> they have been, up till last year been a multi release type of pedal.
>> You could twist your foot left of right and disengage or you could
>> tilt you foot outward and release. This last type of release ( the
>> outward tilt one) cost me a painful spill last year. I am now
>> riding the newer version that is single release and the pedal is MUCH
>> more secure.
>
> If these are similar to Shimano SPD pedals, it's the cleat (not the
> pedal) that determines whether there is single or multiple modes of
> release.
>
> Art Harris
>

Right, and some of the Wellgo pedals are compatible with Shimano cleats
and some aren't. All of the Wellgo pedals I bought (>10 pairs over the
years) have had single-release cleats (typically "98A", IIRC).

[Ozark Bicycle]

On Oct 30, 7:16 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Peter Cole wrote:
> > Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
> >>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M"
> >>> SPuDs, but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>
> >> Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do
> >> not buy) list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became
> >> unexpectedly disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats). I
> >> doubt it's a bit issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that
> >> much energy into the cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by
> >> including them in their models which have SPD only on one side, with a
> >> standard pedal platform on the other) is in sync with that.
>
> > The SH-55 is all I use on all my bikes (road & off-road). I much prefer
> > them to the single-release version. I've never had a problem, they've
> > always disengaged when needed and not otherwise.
>
> Do you have the release tension set very high?
>

Apparently, high enough to prevent unintended release.

[Peter Cole]

Tom Sherman wrote:
> Peter Cole wrote:
>> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>>>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M"
>>>> SPuDs, but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>>>
>>> Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do
>>> not buy) list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they became
>>> unexpectedly disengaged from their pedals (when using those cleats).
>>> I doubt it's a bit issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't put that
>>> much energy into the cranks, and the market that Shimano targets (by
>>> including them in their models which have SPD only on one side, with
>>> a standard pedal platform on the other) is in sync with that.
>>
>> The SH-55 is all I use on all my bikes (road & off-road). I much
>> prefer them to the single-release version. I've never had a problem,
>> they've always disengaged when needed and not otherwise.
>
> Do you have the release tension set very high?
>

No, usually low. The only difference between S-R & M-R cleats is that
the M-R also release with a foot "roll" (as well as default twist). I
take some care to ensure that my cleats are mounted such that pressing
on the pedal doesn't create any roll forces.

I guess it's a matter of trading off potential unintended release vs.
foot trapping. I have a friend who required extensive surgery and rehab
to repair a spiral fracture from a foot trap during a low speed fall. I
also know several others who were injured from pedal "pull outs", using
various cleats.

I don't race, so I rarely "pull up" on pedals, and view the practice as
dangerous. When I do, in circumstances like uphill slogs on my fixer,
I'm careful to anticipate a potential pull out. I think it has only
happened once, with worn cleats, and I didn't spill. I can't recall ever
having a problem with release during a downstroke. I suppose that could
be dangerous during a standing sprint, but that's something I very
rarely do.

[jim beam]

Peter Cole wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> Peter Cole wrote:
>>> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>>>>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M"
>>>>> SPuDs, but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>>>>
>>>> Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do
>>>> not buy) list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they
>>>> became unexpectedly disengaged from their pedals (when using those
>>>> cleats). I doubt it's a bit issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't
>>>> put that much energy into the cranks, and the market that Shimano
>>>> targets (by including them in their models which have SPD only on
>>>> one side, with a standard pedal platform on the other) is in sync
>>>> with that.
>>>
>>> The SH-55 is all I use on all my bikes (road & off-road). I much
>>> prefer them to the single-release version. I've never had a problem,
>>> they've always disengaged when needed and not otherwise.
>>
>> Do you have the release tension set very high?
>>
>
> No, usually low. The only difference between S-R & M-R cleats is that
> the M-R also release with a foot "roll" (as well as default twist). I
> take some care to ensure that my cleats are mounted such that pressing
> on the pedal doesn't create any roll forces.
>
> I guess it's a matter of trading off potential unintended release vs.
> foot trapping. I have a friend who required extensive surgery and rehab
> to repair a spiral fracture from a foot trap during a low speed fall.

it was their toppling off the bike that caused the injury, not "foot
trap". clipless release every single time in a "real" crash.


> I
> also know several others who were injured from pedal "pull outs", using
> various cleats.

then they're either doing something wrong or using cheapo equipment and
being negligent with maintenance. toe clips are by far one of the best
inventions in the whole evolution of the bicycle. and they are
spectacularly reliable.


>
> I don't race, so I rarely "pull up" on pedals, and view the practice as
> dangerous.

wow. how did you ever manage back in the days of toe clips? those
things would pull out when you didn't want and trap you when you needed
to release. modern clipless pedals, with unworn cleats and well
adjusted, can withstand the strongest sprinters in the world, yet
release with a few ounces in the right direction, and every single time
you crash.


> When I do, in circumstances like uphill slogs on my fixer,
> I'm careful to anticipate a potential pull out. I think it has only
> happened once, with worn cleats, and I didn't spill. I can't recall ever
> having a problem with release during a downstroke. I suppose that could
> be dangerous during a standing sprint, but that's something I very
> rarely do.

typical peter cole.

[Tom Sherman]

Peter Cole wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> Peter Cole wrote:
>>> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>>>>> For what its worth, I have had accidental release with SH-55 "M"
>>>>> SPuDs, but not with SH-51 "S" SPuD cleats.
>>>>
>>>> Your experience is not unusual. The SH-55 cleat is on our "DNB" (do
>>>> not buy) list. People can, and have, hurt themselves when they
>>>> became unexpectedly disengaged from their pedals (when using those
>>>> cleats). I doubt it's a bit issue with a casual cyclist that doesn't
>>>> put that much energy into the cranks, and the market that Shimano
>>>> targets (by including them in their models which have SPD only on
>>>> one side, with a standard pedal platform on the other) is in sync
>>>> with that.
>>>
>>> The SH-55 is all I use on all my bikes (road & off-road). I much
>>> prefer them to the single-release version. I've never had a problem,
>>> they've always disengaged when needed and not otherwise.
>>
>> Do you have the release tension set very high?
>>
>
> No, usually low. The only difference between S-R & M-R cleats is that
> the M-R also release with a foot "roll" (as well as default twist). I
> take some care to ensure that my cleats are mounted such that pressing
> on the pedal doesn't create any roll forces.
>
> I guess it's a matter of trading off potential unintended release vs.
> foot trapping. I have a friend who required extensive surgery and rehab
> to repair a spiral fracture from a foot trap during a low speed fall. I
> also know several others who were injured from pedal "pull outs", using
> various cleats.
>
> I don't race, so I rarely "pull up" on pedals, and view the practice as
> dangerous. When I do, in circumstances like uphill slogs on my fixer,
> I'm careful to anticipate a potential pull out. I think it has only
> happened once, with worn cleats, and I didn't spill. I can't recall ever
> having a problem with release during a downstroke. I suppose that could
> be dangerous during a standing sprint, but that's something I very
> rarely do.

I have accidentally had release with the "M" cleats while sprinting hard
on a recumbent (so no standing). This has NOT happened with "S" cleats.

I now have "S" cleats on my SiDi shoes, and "M" cleats on my sandals,
which reflects my choice of footwear for different types of riding.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
When did ignorance of biology become a "family value"?

[Peter Cole]

Tom Sherman wrote:

> I have accidentally had release with the "M" cleats while sprinting hard
> on a recumbent (so no standing). This has NOT happened with "S" cleats.
>
> I now have "S" cleats on my SiDi shoes, and "M" cleats on my sandals,
> which reflects my choice of footwear for different types of riding.

I'd be pretty conservative with cleats if I rode a recumbent, too.

[Tom Sherman]

Peter Cole wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>
>> I have accidentally had release with the "M" cleats while sprinting
>> hard on a recumbent (so no standing). This has NOT happened with "S"
>> cleats.
>>
>> I now have "S" cleats on my SiDi shoes, and "M" cleats on my sandals,
>> which reflects my choice of footwear for different types of riding.
>
> I'd be pretty conservative with cleats if I rode a recumbent, too.
>
Foot retention is indeed of greater importance to us laid back types.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
When did ignorance of biology become a "family value"?

[jim beam]

Peter Cole wrote:
> Bill Sornson wrote:
>> jim beam wrote:
>>> Jambo wrote:
>>>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:15ydnTR-2-l88LzanZ2dnUVZ_sHinZ2d@speakeasy.net...
>>>>> Jambo wrote:
>>>>>>> 1. the metal on the 55/56 cleats is softer so they bind in the
>>>>>>> pedal, especially when gritty. the normal [harder metal] sh51
>>>>>>> cleats are correspondingly "easier to operate".
>>>>>> "Softer metal"? ****ing bull****, beamboy.
>>>>> er, no, moron. different alloys. different hardness. do your
>>>>> homework.
>>>> Hey idiot, show your proof that sh55 and sh56 metals are "softer"
>>>> than sh51.
>>> you are such a moron jambo. go buy yourself a set of both cleats,
>>> then do some hardness testing. prove me wrong.
>>
>>
>> Quick anecdote: when I used SPD pedals and cleats for mountain biking
>> (since switched to Eggbeaters -- now those are some REALLY soft cleats
>> {brass IINM}), I could tell a definite difference between the "single
>> release" and "multi release" cleats. The former gave a nice, firm
>> CLICK when engaged and disengaged; the latter felt mushy when clicking
>> in and out.
>>
>> I didn't investigate to see whether it was a design difference or
>> actual hardness qualities, but the cleats were quite (and
>> unmistakenly) distinct.
>
> The only difference was the shape of the "nose" and the color. In some
> circles, the single-release were known as "the black cleats of death".

baseless, irrelevant, unsupportable fud.

[SocSecTrainWreck@earthlink.net]

Peter Cole wrote:
> SocSecTrainWreck@earthlink.net wrote:
> > Jambo wrote:
> >> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
> >> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
> >> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you can
> >> unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.
> >
> > Although I use SPDs, I don't know much about the technicalities of
> > this "discussion", having never really got beyond tightening the
> > release force; however, I can tell you one thing: staying clipped in
> > on a mountain bike is not about how spastic you are while pedaling,
> > it's about staying attached to your bike and maintaining control while
> > you are flying, bumping, jumping and twisting. The forces on the
> > pedals come from a lot of different directions.
> >
>
> Yea, but if you watch BMX'ers do the same (& worse) they just use plain
> pedals.

Yes, and I was wondering if someone would bring that up, although I'm
not sure what exactly it has to do with my point. My point was that
mountain bikers can have a difficult time staying clipped into their
pedals for reasons other than being spastic. I think that if you are
using platform pedals in the first place it becomes kind of absurd to
talk about what might make the pedals' nonexistent fasteners release.

I also don't actually think that BMXers "do the same", by which I
don't mean to question their skill. I suspect that skilled BMXers
probably use clipless pedals on their MTBs when they are going
mountain biking..

[Peter Cole]

SocSecTrainWreck@earthlink.net wrote:
> Peter Cole wrote:
>> SocSecTrainWreck@earthlink.net wrote:
>>> Jambo wrote:
>>>> Absolute rubbish. Release in one direction does not mean "more secure"
>>>> idiot, unless you're a ****ing spastic who wobbles your feet more than 45
>>>> degrees either way while pedalling. Spring release adjustment means you can
>>>> unclip without twisting at whatever force you want.
>>> Although I use SPDs, I don't know much about the technicalities of
>>> this "discussion", having never really got beyond tightening the
>>> release force; however, I can tell you one thing: staying clipped in
>>> on a mountain bike is not about how spastic you are while pedaling,
>>> it's about staying attached to your bike and maintaining control while
>>> you are flying, bumping, jumping and twisting. The forces on the
>>> pedals come from a lot of different directions.
>>>
>> Yea, but if you watch BMX'ers do the same (& worse) they just use plain
>> pedals.
>
> Yes, and I was wondering if someone would bring that up, although I'm
> not sure what exactly it has to do with my point. My point was that
> mountain bikers can have a difficult time staying clipped into their
> pedals for reasons other than being spastic. I think that if you are
> using platform pedals in the first place it becomes kind of absurd to
> talk about what might make the pedals' nonexistent fasteners release.
>
> I also don't actually think that BMXers "do the same", by which I
> don't mean to question their skill. I suspect that skilled BMXers
> probably use clipless pedals on their MTBs when they are going
> mountain biking..
>

I guess, but the point I was trying to make was just how necessary
clipless pedals are and, perhaps more to the point of this thread, just
how dangerous unintentional release is, especially vs. the issue of
non-release in a crash.

Mike J seems (and you) to feel multi-release pedals are too dangerous.
For mountain biking, where crashes are common, I feel safer with them. I
standardized on them for all my bikes just because my reflexes got
trained to roll rather than twist out of pedals. For road riding perhaps
the advantage goes to single-release, but I still don't consider m-r
dangerous.