Recumbents useful?

[Tom Sherman]

Chalo Colina wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> Scott Gordo wrote:
>>> From looking at that cruzbike.com page, it dawned on me that
>>> recumbents must require more of a leap of faith handling-wise. Looks
>>> like there's no way to redistribute your weight, and I don't see much
>>> of a way to plant a foot to prevent a crash.
>>
>> The CruzBike does look to have the weight distribution too far forward.
>
> The Cruzbike's traction probably benefits from it's weight bias to the
> drive wheel. I'm pretty sure that its handling suffers more from
> pedal-steering than it does from its weight distribution. But once
> you've made the decisive handling compromise of going to any kind of
> 'bent layout, the specific problems are just details. It's like
> complaining about a necktie that flaps in your face when you've
> already jumped out of a tall building.

With all due respect, commenting on the handling of recumbents would be
better left to those that have some experience of the variety. I have
ridden recumbents that require almost no effort to steer and balance,
and poorly designed others that are barely controllable. There is a far
greater variation in recumbents than there is in upright bicycles.

>> You can not do the same type of maneuvers on a recumbent as on a
>> upright, but this is really only of concern in technical off-road riding
>> or certain types of non-vehicular cycling. For many types of riding,
>> these limitations are unimportant.
>
> You can call it "unimportant" to limit your bike travel only to places
> where you can take the lane (or a paved shoulder), but actually
> getting places is easier and much more versatile when you can also
> take to the sidewalk or the grassy margins as appropriate-- even if
> those facilities are not blessed with curb cuts.

I never found this to be a significant disadvantage. I prefer NOT to
ride in these odd places, since both pedestrians and motorists will not
be watching for potential conflicts coming from these areas,
substantially increasing the risk of collisions.

> 'Bents don't appear to do well in city centers, or in well-populated
> suburbs.

Huh? I have spent plenty of time riding a recumbent in such areas with
not difficulty. Again, we have a non-recumbent riding "expert" on
recumbents. :(

> Judging by the places I ever see them riding more than once
> in a rare while, it looks like they are best suited to riding on multi-
> use paths and inconvenient byways avoided by motorists. I expect that
> they'd be OK on the open road, but I don't think I've ever seen one
> out in the countryside.

I have seen plenty (relative to their share of the bicycle market) of
recumbents on the open road. In fact, due to the greater comfort and
upright to slightly reclined head position, recumbents are an excellent
choice for long-distance touring.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

[Edward Dolan]

"Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@REMOVETHISyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:firn91$naq$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> Chalo Colina wrote:
[...]
>> 'Bents don't appear to do well in city centers, or in well-populated
>> suburbs.
>
> Huh? I have spent plenty of time riding a recumbent in such areas with no
> difficulty. Again, we have a non-recumbent riding "expert" on recumbents.
> :(

I wonder if Tom Sherman has ever ridden an upright for any length of time?
The fact is that they will go places easily that a recumbent can only
negotiate with awkwardness. An upright is like a deer springing through
traffic; a recumbent is more like a lumbering elephant.
[...]

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

[Peter Clinch]

Tom Sherman wrote:
> Chalo Colina wrote:

>> Judging by the places I ever see them riding more than once
>> in a rare while, it looks like they are best suited to riding on multi-
>> use paths and inconvenient byways avoided by motorists. I expect that
>> they'd be OK on the open road, but I don't think I've ever seen one
>> out in the countryside.
>
> I have seen plenty (relative to their share of the bicycle market) of
> recumbents on the open road. In fact, due to the greater comfort and
> upright to slightly reclined head position, recumbents are an excellent
> choice for long-distance touring.

Indeed, judging by the use I make of mine, Chalo is wrong. I use
it on Real Roads in the countryside more often than I use it
anywhere else (it is, after all, a specific touring example)

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

[Just A User]

Tom Sherman wrote:
> Chalo Colina wrote:
>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>> Scott Gordo wrote:
>>>> From looking at that cruzbike.com page, it dawned on me that
>>>> recumbents must require more of a leap of faith handling-wise. Looks
>>>> like there's no way to redistribute your weight, and I don't see much
>>>> of a way to plant a foot to prevent a crash.
> >>
>>> The CruzBike does look to have the weight distribution too far forward.
>>
>> The Cruzbike's traction probably benefits from it's weight bias to the
>> drive wheel. I'm pretty sure that its handling suffers more from
>> pedal-steering than it does from its weight distribution. But once
>> you've made the decisive handling compromise of going to any kind of
>> 'bent layout, the specific problems are just details. It's like
>> complaining about a necktie that flaps in your face when you've
>> already jumped out of a tall building.
>
> With all due respect, commenting on the handling of recumbents would be
> better left to those that have some experience of the variety. I have
> ridden recumbents that require almost no effort to steer and balance,
> and poorly designed others that are barely controllable. There is a far
> greater variation in recumbents than there is in upright bicycles.
>
>>> You can not do the same type of maneuvers on a recumbent as on a
>>> upright, but this is really only of concern in technical off-road riding
>>> or certain types of non-vehicular cycling. For many types of riding,
>>> these limitations are unimportant.
>>
>> You can call it "unimportant" to limit your bike travel only to places
>> where you can take the lane (or a paved shoulder), but actually
>> getting places is easier and much more versatile when you can also
>> take to the sidewalk or the grassy margins as appropriate-- even if
>> those facilities are not blessed with curb cuts.
>
> I never found this to be a significant disadvantage. I prefer NOT to
> ride in these odd places, since both pedestrians and motorists will not
> be watching for potential conflicts coming from these areas,
> substantially increasing the risk of collisions.
>
>> 'Bents don't appear to do well in city centers, or in well-populated
>> suburbs.
>
> Huh? I have spent plenty of time riding a recumbent in such areas with
> not difficulty. Again, we have a non-recumbent riding "expert" on
> recumbents. :(
>
>> Judging by the places I ever see them riding more than once
>> in a rare while, it looks like they are best suited to riding on multi-
>> use paths and inconvenient byways avoided by motorists. I expect that
>> they'd be OK on the open road, but I don't think I've ever seen one
>> out in the countryside.
>
> I have seen plenty (relative to their share of the bicycle market) of
> recumbents on the open road. In fact, due to the greater comfort and
> upright to slightly reclined head position, recumbents are an excellent
> choice for long-distance touring.
>

Ever recumbent is different. Some are more suitable for riding in one
type of situation other are better in other situation, which is pretty
much the same as diamond frame bicycles. I ride my V2 in town almost
exclusively, even though I have two diamond frames sitting in my garage.
Once the new recumbent rider becomes proficient at riding their
recumbent they will be at home in more and more situations and
conditions. Would I choose to ride my V2 in New York city as a commuter?
Probably not. I would probably choose a short wheel base for that
situation.

[Tom Sherman]

Edward Dolan wrote:
> "Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@REMOVETHISyahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:firn91$naq$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>> Chalo Colina wrote:
> [...]
>>> 'Bents don't appear to do well in city centers, or in well-populated
>>> suburbs.
>> Huh? I have spent plenty of time riding a recumbent in such areas with no
>> difficulty. Again, we have a non-recumbent riding "expert" on recumbents.
>> :(
>
> I wonder if Tom Sherman has ever ridden an upright for any length of time?
> The fact is that they will go places easily that a recumbent can only
> negotiate with awkwardness. An upright is like a deer springing through
> traffic; a recumbent is more like a lumbering elephant.
> [...]

I purchased my first quality upright bicycle (a Peugeot P-8 from Andrew
Muzi at Yellow Jersey) in 1982, and my first recumbent (RANS Wave) in
1999. Do the math.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

[Chalo]

Edward Dolan wrote:
>
> An upright is like a deer springing through
> traffic; a recumbent is more like a lumbering elephant.

A dog with one front leg.

Chalo

[Edward Dolan]

"Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@REMOVETHISyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:firpes$u5q$2@registered.motzarella.org...
> Edward Dolan wrote:
>> "Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@REMOVETHISyahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:firn91$naq$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>>> Chalo Colina wrote:
>> [...]
>>>> 'Bents don't appear to do well in city centers, or in well-populated
>>>> suburbs.
>>> Huh? I have spent plenty of time riding a recumbent in such areas with
>>> no difficulty. Again, we have a non-recumbent riding "expert" on
>>> recumbents. :(
>>
>> I wonder if Tom Sherman has ever ridden an upright for any length of
>> time? The fact is that they will go places easily that a recumbent can
>> only negotiate with awkwardness. An upright is like a deer springing
>> through traffic; a recumbent is more like a lumbering elephant.
>> [...]
>
> I purchased my first quality upright bicycle (a Peugeot P-8 from Andrew
> Muzi at Yellow Jersey) in 1982, and my first recumbent (RANS Wave) in
> 1999. Do the math.

Yes, 15 years is long enough for an upright. That was about my limit too.

My first bike was a Gitane low end model that I got in 1974 for $140. My
last upright was a Trek carbon fiber 15 years later that I got for $800.,
but I had already made the switch to recumbents part-time by then. For
several years I was riding both uprights and recumbents, but finally I could
no longer stand the pain that accompanied the upright on trips of over 2
hours - and so I switched over to recumbents full-time and I have never
looked back.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

[datakoll]

-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l41L_q1Dp6w

[datakoll]

we ben barbecueing on ours today mmmmmmmmmmmm good xmas ground hog
after we took out dah lectric motor

[Tom Sherman]

datakoll aka gene daniels wrote:
>
> we ben barbecueing on ours today mmmmmmmmmmmm good xmas ground hog
> after we took out dah lectric motor

Well, that clarifies everything.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

[It's Chris]

Maybe to all, but one thing cannot be denied. ALL recumbents are pretty
much useless to anyone else in a pace line who is not likewise reumbent.
;-3)>

- -
Compliments of:
"Your Friendly Neighborhood Wheelman"

If you want to E-mail me use:
ChrisZCorner "at" webtv "dot" net

My website:
http://geocities.com/czcorner

[Tom Sherman]

It's Chris wrote:
> Maybe to all, but one thing cannot be denied. ALL recumbents are pretty
> much useless to anyone else in a pace line who is not likewise re[c]umbent.

With a faired recumbent, who needs a pace line?

A recumbent pace line is superior to an upright pace line, since you do
not end up having to look at some guy's posterior for most of the ride.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

[Dane Buson]

Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@removethisyahoo.com> wrote:
> It's Chris wrote:
>> Maybe to all, but one thing cannot be denied. ALL recumbents are pretty
>> much useless to anyone else in a pace line who is not likewise re[c]umbent.
>
> With a faired recumbent, who needs a pace line?
>
> A recumbent pace line is superior to an upright pace line, since you do
> not end up having to look at some guy's posterior for most of the ride.

Once again, I submit that you are riding with the wrong people.

http://www.point83.com/calendar (This years edition) [1]

We're a pretty accepting bunch. Hell, we even have recumbents along for
our rides pretty frqueently. As long as you don't punch anyone, you'll
probably get along fine.

[1] Which is a bit racier than last years.

--
Dane Buson - sigdane@unixbigots.org
If I were a grave-digger or even a hangman, there are some people I could
work for with a great deal of enjoyment.
-- Douglas Jerrold