Tour of California

[Tom Kunich]

The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we should
also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years and
certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.

Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's biggest
race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race promoters
which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing demonstrates,
that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a sport.

What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see bicycle
racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking possibly to near
nothing in Europe.

[Kurgan Gringioni]

On Feb 24, 11:32*am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:

>
> Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
> interest in bicycling

<snip>



Dumbass -


As you've posted many times before, that is *your* impression.

Others disagreed.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

[Tom_A]

On Feb 24, 11:32 am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we should
> also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years and
> certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.
>

Incredibly bad?...not really.

IMO, if they keep the TOC in the present calendar spot, there's going
to be a year where there's a FULL week of torrential rain some year.
They've gotten rained on this year, but not really that bad.

As the TOC gains stature vs. the other "tours" in the US, it would
probably make more sense to move it to the April spot of the TOG.
Might be able to put in some Sierra climbs too as a bonus.

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

"Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote in message
news:13s3hje1nk0lc85@corp.supernews.com...
| The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we should
| also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years
and
| certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.

No, this is a "normal" year for rain. In fact, it's "normal" based on
rolling averages; if you go back 15 years, on average, a typical winter was
much rainier than now. California has basically been in a drought since,
what, 1993? Good for the bicycle business, bad for rice farmers. My mother's
side of the family (rice farmers in the Sacramento Valley) are probably
quite happy right now. They've seen their water allocations slashed
dramatically since the early 1990s. (For those unaware, rice uses a *lot* of
water, as you have to literally flood the fields)

| Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
| interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's biggest
| race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race promoters
| which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing demonstrates,
| that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a sport.

I don't know where you get that idea. Cycling in Europe remains hip, trendy
& huge. Events here that typically get 2-5,000 people get up to 15,000 in
Europe. Whole regions get shut down for multi-day cycling festivals. As you
travel through France you'll see signs up many months in advance for them.
Towns *love* cyclists, because they bring money. Events in the US are rarely
in the same league. We're mired in turf battles to get any sort of event off
the ground. In Europe, if you read the behind-the-scenes goings-on, people
work together from various agencies to make things happen. They actually
WANT cyclists to take over their roads for a few days.

Racing and Sport cycling are two entirely different things. I do agree that
it's possible the ASO & UCI could participate in a general decline in
interest in cycling. but near as I can tell, it hasn't happened yet.

| What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see
bicycle
| racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking possibly to near
| nothing in Europe.

I certainly hope we see a strong decade of growth in the US, and obviously
partly for selfish reasons. But that growth is more likely to come from the
lobbying work hundreds of unpaid advocates are doing, every single day, in
every state across the country, than from anything the ASO or UCI does.
There are people working behind the scenes that nobody knows about. People
who attend city council meetings and discover that a new development
proposal essentially cuts off cycling access to prime routes, and makes it
known that that's not acceptable. People who attend state & national DOT
(Department of Transportation) meetings to make sure that the needs of
cyclists are accommodated by default, rather than afterthought (and not just
bike lines but traffic signals that work for cyclists, intersections that a
cyclist has a chance of surviving, shoulders that don't have rumble strips
that make a road hazardous to bikes, that sort of thing).

None of this is to say that the ASO isn't completely clueless and may
single-handedly create a less-friendly attitude towards cyclists in France.
But I don't think it's happened, yet.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[Robert Chung]

On Feb 24, 11:32 am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> But we should also
> remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years and
> certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.

http://anonymous.coward.free.fr/temp/sf-rain.png

[Colin Campbell]

Tom Kunich wrote:
> The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we
> should also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last
> 20 years and certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.
>
> Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
> interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's biggest
> race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race
> promoters which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing
> demonstrates, that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a
> sport.
>
> What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see
> bicycle racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking
> possibly to near nothing in Europe.

Incredibly bad? Heck, it just rained on some days, and the temps were
as low as the mid-40F's (maybe 7 - 8C). The riders had a headwind some
of the time, too.

Orange County, where I live, had an incredibly low rainfall total last
year (around 2 inches). I believe most of the state was similarly
affected. This year is above normal for the date, but not even double
the normal amount, at 10 inches. There have been a couple of 30 inch
years while I've lived here, including one within the last five years.
The wildfires of last fall and the rain this winter have not resulted in
the widely predicted mudslides and avalanches - at least not yet.

I have only missed riding two days this year. January 18, I was
volunteering at the UCI World Cup track races, and yesterday, I was at
the Tour of California (luckily, at the CSC VIP tent 50 meters from the
finish line, with food, beverages, shelter, TV, and SWAG!).

The Tour of California had incredibly good luck the first two years for
a race staged in winter. Their luck ran out in 2008, as normal winter
weather prevailed. Nothing incredible about that, in my opinion.

I hope bicycle racing does grow in the USA. (When did the USA ever have
three week long stage races before, like last year?) But I expect it
will remain stronger in Europe and that some of the (incredibly)
unfathomable things going on right now will get straightened out.

[amit.ghosh@gmail.com]

On Feb 24, 2:32 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we should
> also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years and
> certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.
>
> Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
> interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's biggest
> race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race promoters
> which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing demonstrates,
> that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a sport.
>
> What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see bicycle
> racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking possibly to near
> nothing in Europe.

Dumbass,

The "ToC will displace the TdF as a premier event" is this year's
version of the "Hincapie will be a Tour GC contender" discussion.

You have to have your head totally up your ass to even consider it for
a second.

[sergio]

On 24 Feb, 21:16, Tom_A <theanha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Feb 24, 11:32 am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>
> > The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year.
> IMO, if they keep the TOC in the present calendar spot, there's going
> to be a year where there's a FULL week of torrential rain some year.
> They've gotten rained on this year, but not really that bad.

Pardon me, which year are you talking about?

Sergio
Pisa

[Tom_A]

On Feb 24, 12:21 pm, sergio <serva...@df.unipi.it> wrote:
> On 24 Feb, 21:16, Tom_A <theanha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 24, 11:32 am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>
> > > The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year.
> > IMO, if they keep the TOC in the present calendar spot, there's going
> > to be a year where there's a FULL week of torrential rain some year.
> > They've gotten rained on this year, but not really that bad.
>
> Pardon me, which year are you talking about?
>
> Sergio
> Pisa

This year on the weather really not being THAT bad...
On getting a full week of bad rain...that's just a high probability
for the future if the current TOC calendar spot is kept. So for that,
it's an unknown year in the future. Did that answer your question?

[Tom Kunich]

"Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:RQkwj.3498$tW.2130@nlpi070.nbdc.sbc.com...
> "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote in message
> news:13s3hje1nk0lc85@corp.supernews.com...
>
> | Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
> | interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's biggest
> | race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race
> promoters
> | which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing
> demonstrates,
> | that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a sport.
>
> I don't know where you get that idea. Cycling in Europe remains hip,
> trendy
> & huge.

Europe yes, France no. You don't find it significant that there isn't more
than one bicycle shop in Paris that could compare with either of yours?

> | What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see
> bicycle
> | racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking possibly to
> near
> | nothing in Europe.
>
> I certainly hope we see a strong decade of growth in the US, and obviously
> partly for selfish reasons. But that growth is more likely to come from
> the
> lobbying work hundreds of unpaid advocates are doing, every single day, in
> every state across the country, than from anything the ASO or UCI does.

You might believe that but when those in Europe start making their "sport"
look a lot like Roller Derby you can expect people to start looking away.

> None of this is to say that the ASO isn't completely clueless and may
> single-handedly create a less-friendly attitude towards cyclists in
> France.
> But I don't think it's happened, yet.

I think that it has as of the start of the season last year and then the
loss of control of the UCI.

Now don't get me wrong, I don't much like the way the UCI is managed but the
sport absolutely requires a group that manages the sporting rules of the
game so that individual promoters don't turn it into WWF wrestling.

[Michael Baldwin]

Mike*Jacoubowsky wrote -

>I certainly hope we see a strong decade of growth
>in the US, and obviously partly for selfish reasons. But
>that growth is more likely to come from the lobbying
>work hundreds of unpaid advocates are doing, every single day,
>in every state across the country, than from anything the
>ASO or UCI does.

Mike, I agree with your summary. _Keep_ building the infrastructure.

As an example, hopefully by the time my grandchildren are my age, the
sport of cycling in the U.S. will be as "accepted" as american soccer is
today.

I say ignore the "men in jackets" and their politics. Americans always
embrace "grass root" issues. Bicycle advocacy is one such cause.

Best Regards - Mike Baldwin

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

| > | Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack
of
| > | interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's
biggest
| > | race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race
| > promoters
| > | which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing
| > demonstrates,
| > | that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a sport.
| >
| > I don't know where you get that idea. Cycling in Europe remains hip,
| > trendy
| > & huge.
|
| Europe yes, France no. You don't find it significant that there isn't more
| than one bicycle shop in Paris that could compare with either of yours?

That's an entirely different issue. "Retail" in France is an interesting...
concept. In the US, one expects more expertise and service from a local
business than from a Sears or K-Mart or whatever. Not in France. In France,
the concept of "service", as those in the US know it, is being driven by
chain stores like Decathlon and, to a lesser degree, Intersports. The local
business is often not open on weekends, takes two hours in the middle of the
day for lunch, and has a very patronizing attitude towards customers. And it
sometimes goes downhill from there. Not in all cases; the shop in Bourg
d'Oisans, for example, seems like a pretty decent place.

I think there's a lot of room in France for someone to move in and take a
pretty good share of the market. Then again, this could just show my
ignorance of the cultural differences between the US & France.

| > | What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see
| > bicycle
| > | racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking possibly to
| > near
| > | nothing in Europe.
| >
| > I certainly hope we see a strong decade of growth in the US, and
obviously
| > partly for selfish reasons. But that growth is more likely to come from
| > the
| > lobbying work hundreds of unpaid advocates are doing, every single day,
in
| > every state across the country, than from anything the ASO or UCI does.
|
| You might believe that but when those in Europe start making their "sport"
| look a lot like Roller Derby you can expect people to start looking away.

I assume you saw the original "Rollerball" movie? Kind of a brutal evolution
of the 6-Day, don't you think? It's ironic that, with all the doping issues
we face, we also expect our sport to be somewhat sanitized. What is it about
Roller Derby that you object to? Heck, I was watching my son's LaCross
practice Friday. Yikes! Constant body-checking and nailing people with the
sticks.

| > None of this is to say that the ASO isn't completely clueless and may
| > single-handedly create a less-friendly attitude towards cyclists in
| > France.
| > But I don't think it's happened, yet.
|
| I think that it has as of the start of the season last year and then the
| loss of control of the UCI.
|
| Now don't get me wrong, I don't much like the way the UCI is managed but
the
| sport absolutely requires a group that manages the sporting rules of the
| game so that individual promoters don't turn it into WWF wrestling.

Right. We wouldn't want to take any lessons from a "sport" that brings in
fans & $$$ like the WWF! Or NASCAR.

Sometimes I think MIchael Ball has it exactly right, and other times I think
he's the antichrist.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[datakoll]

On Feb 24, 4:54*pm, Robert Chung <rech...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 24, 11:32 am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>
> > But we should also
> > remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years and
> > certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.
>
> http://anonymous.coward.free.fr/temp/sf-rain.png

well staged, televized, presented and commentaturd, educational for
the "serious" rider. Only missing a coast run with NW wind at 25
knots.
Missing was a large penis from stage left out of that extremely
annoying picture box squirting the dude every time he said Mr.

[Bob Schwartz]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
> Sometimes I think MIchael Ball has it exactly right, and other times I think
> he's the antichrist.

Split the difference and say he's entertaining.

Bob Schwartz

[Fred Fredburger]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

> Sometimes I think MIchael Ball has it exactly right, and other times I think
> he's the antichrist.

Cell phones are proof that the antichrist has it exactly right.

[rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com]

On Feb 25, 12:10 pm, Colin Campbell <cmca...@adelphia.net> wrote:
> Tom Kunich wrote:
> > The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we
> > should also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last
> > 20 years and certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.
>
> Incredibly bad? Heck, it just rained on some days, and the temps were
> as low as the mid-40F's (maybe 7 - 8C). The riders had a headwind some
> of the time, too.

You got sucked into Tom's delusion that there's no global warming and
that, instead, the planet is cooling.

[Tom Kunich]

<rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:d03a84ac-6076-4493-9850-31801229905e@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 25, 12:10 pm, Colin Campbell <cmca...@adelphia.net> wrote:
>> Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we
>> > should also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last
>> > 20 years and certainly isn't representative of what to expect next
>> > year.
>>
>> Incredibly bad? Heck, it just rained on some days, and the temps were
>> as low as the mid-40F's (maybe 7 - 8C). The riders had a headwind some
>> of the time, too.
>
> You got sucked into Tom's delusion that there's no global warming and
> that, instead, the planet is cooling.

So how many miles did you ride last year Robert?

[Donald Munro]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>> Sometimes I think MIchael Ball has it exactly right, and other times I
>> think he's the antichrist.

Fred Fredburger wrote:
> Cell phones are proof that the antichrist has it exactly right.

The Banality of Evil.

[Ryan Cousineau]

In article <47c3bea0$0$30210$ec3e2dad@news.usenetmonster.com>,
Donald Munro <fat-dumbass@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
> >> Sometimes I think MIchael Ball has it exactly right, and other times I
> >> think he's the antichrist.
>
> Fred Fredburger wrote:
> > Cell phones are proof that the antichrist has it exactly right.
>
> The Banality of Evil.

I dunno. Those evil green and black uniforms are starting to grow on me.
I think they're better than Zabriskie's unfortunate
stars-and-stripes-and-argyle TT outfit.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

[rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com]

On Feb 26, 12:45 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:

> > You got sucked into Tom's delusion that there's no global warming and
> > that, instead, the planet is cooling.
>
> So how many miles did you ride last year Robert?

Not sure. I don't track it (it'd be disquieting if I did). I did get
in several early afternoon rides last Fall -- thanks!

[Bob Schwartz]

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:
> On Feb 26, 12:45 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>> So how many miles did you ride last year Robert?
>
> Not sure. I don't track it (it'd be disquieting if I did).

I'm disquieted by the number of people here that
apparently follow NASCAR.

Bob Schwartz

[Tom Kunich]

<rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:c2538020-35f3-4680-8187-5009ba42979e@p73g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 26, 12:45 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>
>> > You got sucked into Tom's delusion that there's no global warming and
>> > that, instead, the planet is cooling.
>>
>> So how many miles did you ride last year Robert?
>
> Not sure. I don't track it (it'd be disquieting if I did). I did get
> in several early afternoon rides last Fall -- thanks!

How long before your spring riding begins?

[Paul G.]

On Feb 26, 1:37 pm, Bob Schwartz <bob.schwa...@REMOVEsbcglobal.net>
wrote:
> rechungREMOVET...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Feb 26, 12:45 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> >> So how many miles did you ride last year Robert?
>
> > Not sure. I don't track it (it'd be disquieting if I did).
>
> I'm disquieted by the number of people here that
> apparently follow NASCAR.
>
> Bob Schwartz

Me too. I thought bike racing fans would get a laugh out of my
comparison between the TOC and NASCAR races in SoCal on Sunday...
-Paul

[Donald Munro]

Bob Schwartz wrote:
> I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently follow NASCAR.

Isn't there some hot chick driving in NASCAR these days ?

[Michael Baldwin]

>I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently
>follow NASCAR.
>Bob Schwartz
>Me too. I thought bike racing fans would get a
>laugh out of my comparison between the TOC and NASCAR
>races in SoCal on Sunday... -Paul

Paul, you've mistakenly equated your own lack of respect for NASCAR,
it's competitors and fans as a mutual belief among "like" minds.
And speaking of minds. Ryan Newman, this years Daytona 500 winner,
holds a degree in vehicle structure engineering from Purdue University.
Newman's Daytona winnings are around $3 million.
NASCAR via ISC is a publicly traded corporation FOR profit on NASDAQ
("hint" USAC).
NASCAR has zero tolerance for controlled substance abuse, and that
includes ALL members of a NASCAR team.
New York's Waldorf Astoria Hotel Grand Ball Room is the annual venue
for NASCAR's awards banquet and season end celebration.
Well Paul, there's several more topics for your "wussie" schtick.

Keep'em laughing dudette!

"just" regards - Mike Baldwin

[rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com]

On Feb 26, 3:39 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:

> How long before your spring riding begins?

???. I'm in the northern hemisphere, same as you. First day of Spring
this year is March 20.

[Ryan Cousineau]

In article
<ad1d2613-9bc7-4649-92c7-83a110651a0a@i12g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:

> On Feb 26, 3:39 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>
> > How long before your spring riding begins?
>
> ???. I'm in the northern hemisphere, same as you. First day of Spring
> this year is March 20.

Hah! Locally, the Spring Series starts March 2nd!

Wait, is that a point for Global Warming or against it?

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

[Howard Kveck]

In article <ad1d2613-9bc7-4649-92c7-83a110651a0a@i12g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:

> On Feb 26, 3:39 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>
> > How long before your spring riding begins?
>
> ???. I'm in the northern hemisphere, same as you. First day of Spring
> this year is March 20.

Bah! That's just more Liberal Global Warming Hysteria!

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

[Kurgan Gringioni]

On Feb 26, 5:23*pm, MLB5...@webtv.net (Michael Baldwin) wrote:
> >I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently
> >follow NASCAR.
> >Bob Schwartz
> >Me too. I thought bike racing fans would get a
> >laugh out of my comparison between the TOC and NASCAR
> >races in SoCal on Sunday... -Paul
>
> * Paul, you've mistakenly equated your own lack of respect for NASCAR,
> it's competitors and fans as a mutual belief among "like" minds.
> *And speaking of minds. *Ryan Newman, this years Daytona 500 winner,
> holds a degree in vehicle structure engineering from Purdue University.
> Newman's Daytona winnings are around $3 million.




Retard -


Your priorities are seriously out of order. $$$$ has nothing to do
with degree of wussiness.

Julia Roberts makes $20million for romantic comedies. She's a wussy.

Pat Tillman turned down a multimillion$ NFL contract extension so that
he could join the Rangers and go fight and die in Afghanistan. Not
exactly a wussy.

Oprah Winfrey? Lots of $$$$. Wussy.

NASCAR drivers? Wussies.

People who equate $$ with wussiness/toughness? Retards.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

[Paul G.]

On Feb 26, 5:23 pm, MLB5...@webtv.net (Michael Baldwin) wrote:
> >I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently
> >follow NASCAR.
> >Bob Schwartz
> >Me too. I thought bike racing fans would get a
> >laugh out of my comparison between the TOC and NASCAR
> >races in SoCal on Sunday... -Paul
>
> Paul, you've mistakenly equated your own lack of respect for NASCAR,
> it's competitors and fans as a mutual belief among "like" minds.
> And speaking of minds. Ryan Newman, this years Daytona 500 winner,
> holds a degree in vehicle structure engineering from Purdue University.
> Newman's Daytona winnings are around $3 million.
> NASCAR via ISC is a publicly traded corporation FOR profit on NASDAQ
> ("hint" USAC).
> NASCAR has zero tolerance for controlled substance abuse, and that
> includes ALL members of a NASCAR team.
> New York's Waldorf Astoria Hotel Grand Ball Room is the annual venue
> for NASCAR's awards banquet and season end celebration.
> Well Paul, there's several more topics for your "wussie" schtick.
>
> Keep'em laughing dudette!
>
> "just" regards - Mike Baldwin

I'm not sure what any of that has to do with the relative wussieness
of NASCAR drivers vs the TOC riders. Grandma quit driving. She's
wussier than NASCAR drivers. The NASCAR drivers quit driving because
it started raining. They're wussier than the TOC riders who rode day
after day in the same rain.

Regarding my "lack of respect for NASCAR, it's competitors and fans",
I just love tipping sacred cows. And I sincerely hope I'm keeping 'em
laughing, dudette!
-Paul

[Michael Baldwin]

Grunge thinks

>Retard -
>Your priorities are seriously out of order. $$$$ has nothing
>to do
>with degree of wussiness.


Hello Grunge, you _****-Head_

Not that it matters, but my point to _PaulG_ was NASCAR et'al is much
more than what he's been told by his so-called nascar friend.

And Grunge, while you're on the subject of retards, wussies and _MY_
priorities, let me tell you about my grandson with cerebral palsy.
He's _MY_ priority. Hopefully you'll never have to be as tough as he
is everyday, for I doubt you could endure. Because when you're
physically and mentally challenged, you can't just fake life on your ass
sitting behind a keyboard. I love you brave little boys that throw in
your worthless 2 ****'in cents about subjects you know nothing tangible
about, just so you can attack someone who does.

I apologize to the group for my outburst and language but obviously,
sometimes I'm just not tough enough myself.

Mike Baldwin

[Kurgan Gringioni]

On Feb 26, 7:01*pm, MLB5...@webtv.net (Michael Baldwin) wrote:
> Grunge thinks
>
> >Retard -
> >Your priorities are seriously out of order. $$$$ has nothing
> >to do
> >with degree of wussiness.
>
> Hello Grunge, you _****-Head_
>
> * Not that it matters, but my point to _PaulG_ was NASCAR et'al is much
> more than what he's been told by his so-called nascar friend. *
>
> * And Grunge, while you're on the subject of retards, wussies and _MY_
> priorities, let me tell you about my grandson with cerebral palsy. *
> * He's _MY_ priority. *Hopefully you'll never have to be as tough as he
> is everyday, for I doubt you could endure. * Because when you're
> physically and mentally challenged, you can't just fake life on your ass
> sitting behind a keyboard. * *I love you brave little boys that throw in
> your worthless 2 ****'in cents about subjects you know nothing tangible
> about, just so you can attack someone who does.
>
> * * I apologize to the group for my outburst and language but obviously,
> sometimes I'm just not tough enough myself.



Retard -


You wrote:

> And speaking of minds. Ryan Newman, this years Daytona 500 winner,
> holds a degree in vehicle structure engineering from Purdue University.
> Newman's Daytona winnings are around $3 million.


Implying that $$$$'s matter.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

[Kyle Legate]

Michael Baldwin wrote:
> Grunge thinks
>
>> Retard -
>> Your priorities are seriously out of order. $$$$ has nothing
>> to do
>> with degree of wussiness.
>
>
> Hello Grunge, you _****-Head_
>
> Not that it matters, but my point to _PaulG_ was NASCAR et'al is much
> more than what he's been told by his so-called nascar friend.
>
> And Grunge, while you're on the subject of retards, wussies and _MY_
> priorities, let me tell you about my grandson with cerebral palsy.
> He's _MY_ priority. Hopefully you'll never have to be as tough as he
> is everyday, for I doubt you could endure. Because when you're
> physically and mentally challenged, you can't just fake life on your ass
> sitting behind a keyboard. I love you brave little boys that throw in
> your worthless 2 ****'in cents about subjects you know nothing tangible
> about, just so you can attack someone who does.
>
This thread has just become infinitely more entertaining.

[Michael Baldwin]

Grunge retorts

>Retard -
>You wrote:
>**And speaking of minds. Ryan Newman, this years Daytona 500
>winner, holds a degree in vehicle structure engineering from Purdue
>University. Newman's Daytona winnings are around $3 million.
>Implying that $$$$'s matter.
>thanks,
>K. Gringioni.

Hello Grunge

What? No further lectures on _my_ priorities? What's up with that?
Gee, you're such an expert on everything I was hoping you'd
enlightment me on how I've been raising a CP child all wrong too.
I can't wait to see how you snip this all out of context as well.

Mike Baldwin

[Kurgan Gringioni]

On Feb 26, 7:49*pm, MLB5...@webtv.net (Michael Baldwin) wrote:
> *Grunge retorts
>
> >Retard -
> >You wrote:
> >**And speaking of minds. Ryan Newman, this years Daytona 500
> >winner, holds a degree in vehicle structure engineering from Purdue
> >University. Newman's Daytona winnings are around $3 million.
> >Implying that $$$$'s matter.
> >thanks,
> >K. Gringioni.
>
> Hello Grunge
>
> * *What? *No further lectures on _my_ priorities? * What's up with that?
> * Gee, you're such an expert on everything I was hoping you'd
> enlightment me on how I've been raising a CP child all wrong too.
> * *I can't wait to see how you snip this all out of context as well. *



Retard -


My condolences to your child for having bad genes.


Best wishes,

K. Gringioni.

[Donald Munro]

Kyle Legate wrote:
> This thread has just become infinitely more entertaining.

Kurgan is on the comeback trail. Must be because its an election year.

[Geraard Spergen]

Donald Munro wrote:
> Bob Schwartz wrote:
>> I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently follow NASCAR.
>
> Isn't there some hot chick driving in NASCAR these days ?
>

Would podium chicks kiss a hot chick? (assuming said hot chick is
actually capable of winning at this manly activity) NASCAR might
become more entertaining too.

[Casey Kerrigan]

In article <47c51a89$0$2884$ec3e2dad@news.usenetmonster.com>, Donald
Munro <fat-dumbass@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Bob Schwartz wrote:
> > I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently follow NASCAR.
>
> Isn't there some hot chick driving in NASCAR these days ?
>
No hot chicks driving in NASCAR. You are probably thinking of Danica
Patrick who drives in the Indy Car Racing League ( a whole nother form
of auto racing who also doesn't race ovals in the rain).

[Bill C]

Geraard Spergen wrote:
> Donald Munro wrote:
> > Bob Schwartz wrote:
> >> I'm disquieted by the number of people here that apparently follow NASCAR.
> >
> > Isn't there some hot chick driving in NASCAR these days ?
> >
>
> Would podium chicks kiss a hot chick? (assuming said hot chick is
> actually capable of winning at this manly activity) NASCAR might
> become more entertaining too.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/features/2008_swimsuit/danica-patrick/

Bill C

[John Forrest Tomlinson]

On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 07:18:30 -0800 (PST), Bill C
<tritonrider@verizon.net> wrote:

>http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/features/2008_swimsuit/danica-patrick/

She's beautiful.

[Geraard Spergen]

amit.ghosh@gmail.com wrote:
> On Feb 24, 2:32 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>> The weather for the Tour has been incredibly bad this year. But we should
>> also remember that this is one of the worst winters in the last 20 years and
>> certainly isn't representative of what to expect next year.
>>
>> Those touring through France have been surprised at the general lack of
>> interest in bicycling despite having what used to be the world's biggest
>> race. This combined by the recent actions of ASO and other race promoters
>> which in the end reduce the competitiveness of those racing demonstrates,
>> that in Europe, racing is more a marketing tool now than a sport.
>>
>> What this suggests is that over the next decade we can expect to see bicycle
>> racing growing a whole lot more in the USA and shrinking possibly to near
>> nothing in Europe.
>
> Dumbass,
>
> The "ToC will displace the TdF as a premier event" is this year's
> version of the "Hincapie will be a *Tour* GC contender" discussion.

There Are Two Now You Know TATNYK