Low bulk nutrition [Archive] - Triangle Cycling

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 04:45 AM

In article <b8dus39n4oshft5qm5r51af233k18jmlk6@4ax.com>,
Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_asale@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:

> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>
> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. It's the ingesting bulk
> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>
> Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
> across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). This is a
> "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. What I
> don't know is any reputation for them.
>
> Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
>
> Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?
>
> Thank you a much.
>
> Abby

For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
alternative.

Back in the real world, energy bars tend to be the highest-density
foodstuff that most people would consider eating in quantity. But if you
like peanut butter, it has about 95 kcal/tablespoon (about 16g). Honey,
that piker, has only about 64 kcal/tbsp, (listed as 21g).

Returning to butter: 100 kcal/tbsp, 14g. Where is your energy bar now?

Of all of these, the only one I've known anyone to try using seriously
is honey, which one of my more thoughtful (about nutrition and exercise
science) club-mates uses as an on-bike energy food. He keeps it in a
little squeeze bottle.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

bjw@mambo.ucolick.org

01-04-1970, 04:45 AM

On Mar 5, 5:04*pm, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>
> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. *It's the ingesting bulk
> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.

That's fair, but you gotta drink water anyway, so it's
hard to avoid. Various gels (Clif Shot) and such approach
100 calories per ounce. They're mostly simple sugars.
Some can be mixed with a little water to get a near-liquid.

The advice might depend on the conditions of use,
I can think of several that require minimum food weight
and bulk -
- weight shaving on hill climbs
- you're prone to hypoglemic episodes but have to wear
clothing without pockets
- your cycling jersey pockets are really small
- tour of duty on Captain Nemo's Nautilus
- ultralight backpacking
- you're building a Mars rocket in your backyard
- RAAN (Race Across Antarctica)

Ben
p.s. Peanuts are 180 calories/ounce. Sure, it's 3/4 fat,
but they taste good.

Kurgan Gringioni

01-04-1970, 04:45 AM

On Mar 5, 4:04*pm, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>
> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. *It's the ingesting bulk
> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>
> Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
> across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). *This is a
> "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. *What I
> don't know is any reputation for them.
>
> Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
>
> Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?

Dear Abby -

For you, I recommend sperm. It's fresh, with an extremely high protein
density.

you're welcome,

K. Gringioni.

joseph.santaniello@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:45 AM

On Mar 6, 1:04*am, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>
> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. *It's the ingesting bulk
> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>
> Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
> across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). *This is a
> "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. *What I
> don't know is any reputation for them.
>
> Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
>
> Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?
>
> Thank you a much.
>
> Abby
>
> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- ---
> * * * * * * * *I am Abby Sale - in Raleigh, North Carolina

http://www.physicalmind.com/pemmican.htm

Joseph

Michael Press

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

In article
<rcousine-0AE273.21173405032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:

> In article <b8dus39n4oshft5qm5r51af233k18jmlk6@4ax.com>,
> Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_asale@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
>
> > Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
> >
> > I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. It's the ingesting bulk
> > I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
> >
> > Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
> > across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). This is a
> > "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. What I
> > don't know is any reputation for them.
> >
> > Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
> >
> > Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?
> >
> > Thank you a much.
> >
> > Abby
>
> For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
> alternative.
>
> Back in the real world, energy bars tend to be the highest-density
> foodstuff that most people would consider eating in quantity. But if you
> like peanut butter, it has about 95 kcal/tablespoon (about 16g). Honey,
> that piker, has only about 64 kcal/tbsp, (listed as 21g).
>
> Returning to butter: 100 kcal/tbsp, 14g. Where is your energy bar now?
>
> Of all of these, the only one I've known anyone to try using seriously
> is honey, which one of my more thoughtful (about nutrition and exercise
> science) club-mates uses as an on-bike energy food. He keeps it in a
> little squeeze bottle.

A major consideration is time and energy required to
digest food. I read, but cannot confirm, that honey
requires considerable time to digest. Infants definitely
should not be fed honey, as their digestion is not
mature enough.

--
Michael Press

Howard Kveck

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

In article <rcousine-0AE273.21173405032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:

> In article <b8dus39n4oshft5qm5r51af233k18jmlk6@4ax.com>,
> Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_asale@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
>
> > Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
> >
> > I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. It's the ingesting bulk
> > I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
> >
> > Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
> > across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). This is a
> > "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. What I
> > don't know is any reputation for them.
> >
> > Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
> >
> > Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?
> >
> > Thank you a much.
> >
> > Abby
>
> For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
> alternative.
>
> Back in the real world, energy bars tend to be the highest-density
> foodstuff that most people would consider eating in quantity. But if you
> like peanut butter, it has about 95 kcal/tablespoon (about 16g). Honey,
> that piker, has only about 64 kcal/tbsp, (listed as 21g).
>
> Returning to butter: 100 kcal/tbsp, 14g. Where is your energy bar now?

Don't forget Plugrá - it's got 82.5% butterfat, whereas most regular butters are
less than 80%. Personally, I find it to be a bit less flavorful than, say, Challenge
unsalted sweet butter.

Don't forget: It's better with butter. (Ewoud can now drop a "Last Tango in Paris"
reference...)

http://www.poubelle.com/butterpig/archives/000172.html

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

On Mar 5, 9:17 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
> alternative.

It's easy to beat lard (lard beaten with sugar makes excellent
frosting, btw).

Butter is 100 kcal/Tbsp.
Lard is 115 kcal/Tbsp.
Canola oil is 124 kcal/Tbsp.

For the OP, two words: meat floss.

Donald Munro

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

Abby Sale wrote:
>> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. It's the ingesting
>> bulk I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not
>> do.

Ryan Cousineau wrote:
> For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
> alternative.

I expected better of you, like a suggestion for some high calorie
Belgian alcoholic beverage.

zzfranklin@mac.com

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

> Infants definitely should not be fed honey,

How will they learn?

Mark & Steven Bornfeld

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

Michael Press wrote:
> In article
> <rcousine-0AE273.21173405032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
> Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <b8dus39n4oshft5qm5r51af233k18jmlk6@4ax.com>,
>> Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_asale@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>>>
>>> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. It's the ingesting bulk
>>> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>>>
>>> Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
>>> across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). This is a
>>> "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. What I
>>> don't know is any reputation for them.
>>>
>>> Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
>>>
>>> Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?
>>>
>>> Thank you a much.
>>>
>>> Abby
>> For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
>> alternative.
>>
>> Back in the real world, energy bars tend to be the highest-density
>> foodstuff that most people would consider eating in quantity. But if you
>> like peanut butter, it has about 95 kcal/tablespoon (about 16g). Honey,
>> that piker, has only about 64 kcal/tbsp, (listed as 21g).
>>
>> Returning to butter: 100 kcal/tbsp, 14g. Where is your energy bar now?
>>
>> Of all of these, the only one I've known anyone to try using seriously
>> is honey, which one of my more thoughtful (about nutrition and exercise
>> science) club-mates uses as an on-bike energy food. He keeps it in a
>> little squeeze bottle.
>
> A major consideration is time and energy required to
> digest food. I read, but cannot confirm, that honey
> requires considerable time to digest. Infants definitely
> should not be fed honey, as their digestion is not
> mature enough.
>

"Because honey can contain spores of Clostridium botulinum and this has
been a source of infection for infants, children less than 12 months old
should not be fed honey. Honey is safe for persons 1 year of age and older."

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/botulism_g.htm

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

On Mar 5, 9:32 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> Infants definitely
> should not be fed honey, as their digestion is not
> mature enough.

Infants definitely should not be fed honey, but it's not because their
digestion isn't mature enough. It's because their immune systems
aren't mature enough to deal with botulin spores.

Ted van de Weteringe

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

Howard Kveck wrote:
> Don't forget: It's better with butter. (Ewoud can now drop a "Last Tango in Paris"
> reference...)

Wow, I did that before in rbr? Can't remember. It's (or I am) weird, I
almost always think about the movie at the lunch table when I ask
someone to fetch me the butter..

Donald Munro

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

Howard Kveck wrote:
> Don't forget: It's better with butter. (Ewoud can now drop a "Last
> Tango in Paris" reference...)
>
> http://www.poubelle.com/butterpig/archives/000172.html

Perhaps you should tell h**2.

Ted van de Weteringe

01-04-1970, 04:47 AM

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:
> It's easy to beat lard

Well, I got beaten by lard. Apparently, calling the site manager a tub
of lard is frowned upon over at the other rbr. I got banned.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=123181

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 04:48 AM

In article <3nbvs3peiofp2d2jmct3mhdhfs6fo4utqd@4ax.com>,
Ted van de Weteringe <myfullname@xs4all.nl.invalid> wrote:

> Howard Kveck wrote:
> > Don't forget: It's better with butter. (Ewoud can now drop a "Last Tango
> > in Paris"
> > reference...)
>
> Wow, I did that before in rbr? Can't remember. It's (or I am) weird, I
> almost always think about the movie at the lunch table when I ask
> someone to fetch me the butter..

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/search?q=Tango+Paris&

The Butter concordance was much less interesting, polluted with phrases
like "peanut butter", "lung butter", and "chamois butter."

It appears the last time Last Tango in Paris came up here, it was Kveck
making the mention, though Chung clearly got the best joke in.

He just slipped it into the thread,

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

Donald Munro

01-04-1970, 04:48 AM

Ted van de Weteringe wrote:

> Well, I got beaten by lard. Apparently, calling the site manager a tub of
> lard is frowned upon over at the other rbr. I got banned.
>
> http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=123181

Kloothommel,
Perhaps you should try dumbass next time.

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:48 AM

On Mar 6, 1:03 am, Ted van de Weteringe <myfulln...@xs4all.nl.invalid>
wrote:
> rechungREMOVET...@gmail.com wrote:
> > It's easy to beat lard
>
> Well, I got beaten by lard. Apparently, calling the site manager a tub
> of lard is frowned upon over at the other rbr. I got banned.
>
> http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=123181

I couldn't see the photos without registering (and now I'm not going
to do that) but how lardy was he? As fat as Fat Stevie?

Recently, I got some complaints related to a post I made on the
Wattage List that included "%^*!@!". No, not the actual words, just
"%^*!@!". One guy said extreme language such as mine was the reason he
didn't post.

Abby Sale

01-04-1970, 04:48 AM

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 01:13:17 -0800 (PST), "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org"
<bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:

>On Mar 5, 5:04*pm, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
>> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>>
>> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. *It's the ingesting bulk
>> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>
>That's fair, but you gotta drink water anyway, so it's
>hard to avoid. Various gels (Clif Shot) and such approach
>100 calories per ounce. They're mostly simple sugars.
>Some can be mixed with a little water to get a near-liquid.
>
>The advice might depend on the conditions of use,
>I can think of several that require minimum food weight
>and bulk -
>- weight shaving on hill climbs
>- you're prone to hypoglemic episodes but have to wear
> clothing without pockets
>- your cycling jersey pockets are really small
>- tour of duty on Captain Nemo's Nautilus
>- ultralight backpacking
>- you're building a Mars rocket in your backyard
>- RAAN (Race Across Antarctica)
>
>Ben
>p.s. Peanuts are 180 calories/ounce. Sure, it's 3/4 fat,
> but they taste good.

Thanks - I didn't want to detail too much burden on youse but maybe I
shoulda.

It really has little to do with exercise or 'power' - it's the practical
experience I wanted to tap.

My 70-year-old wife is chronically & now severely ill. Chronic pain as
well. She simply has no appetite, no food is "attractive" at all. She's
essentially starving. Just nibble a bit then puts the plate down.

I've been urging Ensure Plus or Nutren - both shakes with pretty much the
full nutrition needed daily (in addition to say, an egg or piece of toast
or Scotch & soda.) Each is about 350 cal in 8 oz (US). But these past two
weeks I can't get her to take even three of them daily. "No appetite."

So I'm looking for stuff that will have (as much as possible) all the
nutrition one needs but, liquid or solid, is a minimum actual volume of
material.

(Sigh, I asked her - won't eat peanut butter - a childhood fear or
something - attacked by a vicious peanut, I think.)

Thanks again.

-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- ---
I am Abby Sale - in Raleigh, North Carolina

Michael Press

01-04-1970, 04:48 AM

In article
<a4e6dbd7-fc40-48b8-b82d-250b05e05e2d@o77g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
"bjw@mambo.ucolick.org" <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:

> On Mar 5, 5:04*pm, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> > Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
> >
> > I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. *It's the ingesting bulk
> > I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>
> That's fair, but you gotta drink water anyway, so it's
> hard to avoid. Various gels (Clif Shot) and such approach
> 100 calories per ounce. They're mostly simple sugars.
> Some can be mixed with a little water to get a near-liquid.
>
> The advice might depend on the conditions of use,
> I can think of several that require minimum food weight
> and bulk -
> - weight shaving on hill climbs
> - you're prone to hypoglemic episodes but have to wear
> clothing without pockets
> - your cycling jersey pockets are really small
> - tour of duty on Captain Nemo's Nautilus
> - ultralight backpacking
> - you're building a Mars rocket in your backyard
> - RAAN (Race Across Antarctica)

I'd pay to see that.

> p.s. Peanuts are 180 calories/ounce. Sure, it's 3/4 fat,
> but they taste good.

Almonds, cashews, walnuts, pistachios, and hazelnuts taste good.
Peanuts taste of the legumes they are.

--
Michael Press

SLAVE of THE STATE

01-04-1970, 04:48 AM

On Mar 6, 1:13*am, "b...@mambo.ucolick.org" <b...@mambo.ucolick.org>
wrote:

> p.s. Peanuts are 180 calories/ounce. *Sure, it's 3/4 fat,
> * *but they taste good.

I used to like peanuts and peanut butter till that dickhead Bill Asher
wrecked it for me.

Abby Sale

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 06:08:31 -0800 (PST), "joseph.santaniello@gmail.com"
<joseph.santaniello@gmail.com> wrote:

>http://www.physicalmind.com/pemmican.htm

That's interesting, too. It also fills the "childhood" & young adult
notions from her camping/hiking years.

FYI, the ProBar didn't work. Couldn't bear the taste - or something. They
taste fine - not sickly sweet or chocolatey - to me.

Oh well, the daughter (a Roller Derby star) and/or I to a lesser extant
(inline street skating) can make use of them. 1/2 bar would be a good pre-
or post-exercise chew.

-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- ---
I am Abby Sale - in Raleigh, North Carolina

joseph.santaniello@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

On Mar 6, 3:37*pm, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 01:13:17 -0800 (PST), "b...@mambo.ucolick.org"
>
>
>
> <b...@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:
> >On Mar 5, 5:04*pm, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> >> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
>
> >> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. *It's the ingesting bulk
> >> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
>
> >That's fair, but you gotta drink water anyway, so it's
> >hard to avoid. *Various gels (Clif Shot) and such approach
> >100 calories per ounce. *They're mostly simple sugars.
> >Some can be mixed with a little water to get a near-liquid.
>
> >The advice might depend on the conditions of use,
> >I can think of several that require minimum food weight
> >and bulk -
> >- weight shaving on hill climbs
> >- you're prone to hypoglemic episodes but have to wear
> > *clothing without pockets
> >- your cycling jersey pockets are really small
> >- tour of duty on Captain Nemo's Nautilus
> >- ultralight backpacking
> >- you're building a Mars rocket in your backyard
> >- RAAN (Race Across Antarctica)
>
> >Ben
> >p.s. Peanuts are 180 calories/ounce. *Sure, it's 3/4 fat,
> > * but they taste good.
>
> Thanks - I didn't want to detail too much burden on youse but maybe I
> shoulda.
>
> It really has little to do with exercise or 'power' - it's the practical
> experience I wanted to tap.
>
> My 70-year-old wife is chronically & now severely ill. *Chronic pain as
> well. *She simply has no appetite, no food is "attractive" at all. *She's
> essentially starving. *Just nibble a bit then puts the plate down.
>
> I've been urging Ensure Plus or Nutren - both shakes with pretty much the
> full nutrition needed daily (in addition to say, an egg or piece of toast
> or Scotch & soda.) *Each is about 350 cal in 8 oz (US). *But these past two
> weeks I can't get her to take even three of them daily. *"No appetite." *
>
> So I'm looking for stuff that will have (as much as possible) all the
> nutrition one needs but, liquid or solid, is a minimum actual volume of
> material.
>
> (Sigh, I asked her - won't eat peanut butter - a childhood fear or
> something - attacked by a vicious peanut, I think.)
>
> Thanks again.
>
> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- ---
> * * * * * * * *I am Abby Sale - in Raleigh, North Carolina

Often hi-calorie foods like bars, etc are too sweet in my opinion. I
suppose someone with no appetite might be even less inclined to eat
what tastes like candy.

I wasn't kidding when I suggested Pemmican. Maybe the home-made nature
will also increase it's appeal. With a little rice or something to
make it seem like more of a meal.

Good luck!

Joseph

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

On Mar 6, 6:37 am, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> My 70-year-old wife is chronically & now severely ill. Chronic pain as
> well. She simply has no appetite, no food is "attractive" at all. She's
> essentially starving. Just nibble a bit then puts the plate down.
>
> I've been urging Ensure Plus or Nutren - both shakes with pretty much the
> full nutrition needed daily (in addition to say, an egg or piece of toast
> or Scotch & soda.) Each is about 350 cal in 8 oz (US). But these past two
> weeks I can't get her to take even three of them daily. "No appetite."
>
> So I'm looking for stuff that will have (as much as possible) all the
> nutrition one needs but, liquid or solid, is a minimum actual volume of
> material.

Ensure (and Ensure+, Ensure Protein, Ensure yadda yadda) are really
intended more as supplements than replacements and, since sugar is
often an appetite stimulant, they make them as sweetened "shakes." As
a complete nutritional source, they're way too sweet and eventually
(as you've just discovered) they end up dulling appetite rather than
stimulating it.

You may have to "reset" your wife's taste buds by mixing up her diet.
Salty or savory items are an obvious alternative but sometimes sour or
even slightly bitter can work, too. A problem with Ensure is that it
doesn't have much aroma and smell is often a good way to stimulate
appetite. That means that cooking can work better than plopping an
open can of chocolate shake down in front of her. However, sometimes a
particular aroma (like roasting meat, or fresh coffee, or mushrooms,
or catfish in coconut milk with lemongrass and Thai basil) will
trigger appetite but then the next day it'll make her nauseated.
Sometimes texture will be tempting, but the next day chewing too much
will make her gag. Ask her what she ate as a child -- that could give
you ideas about comfort food that she'll eat. If her appetite is that
suppressed don't try to cram all necessary nutritive needs into one
meal. Nutritional density may be secondary to getting her appetite
back.

> Thanks - I didn't want to detail too much burden on youse but maybe I
> shoulda.

Only if you want serious answers. This is rbr.

Michael Press

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

In article <ltTzj.9712$Td2.4624@trndny08>,
Mark & Steven Bornfeld <bornfeldmung@dentaltwins.com> wrote:

> Michael Press wrote:
> > In article
> > <rcousine-0AE273.21173405032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
> > Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <b8dus39n4oshft5qm5r51af233k18jmlk6@4ax.com>,
> >> Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_asale@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Pardon my butting in but a question youse may well be expert in which.
> >>>
> >>> I'm seeking very low bulk, highly nutritious food. It's the ingesting bulk
> >>> I'm interested in so a food that has to have water added would not do.
> >>>
> >>> Although a liquid would be much more convenient, the best thing I've come
> >>> across so far is ProBars (various online places and REI retail). This is a
> >>> "power bar" at 350 calories of "good stuff" and only 3 ounces. What I
> >>> don't know is any reputation for them.
> >>>
> >>> Are ProBars similar to what their advertising claims?
> >>>
> >>> Any ideas of alternate brands or foods?
> >>>
> >>> Thank you a much.
> >>>
> >>> Abby
> >> For raw caloric density, it's hard to beat lard. Butter is its gourmet
> >> alternative.
> >>
> >> Back in the real world, energy bars tend to be the highest-density
> >> foodstuff that most people would consider eating in quantity. But if you
> >> like peanut butter, it has about 95 kcal/tablespoon (about 16g). Honey,
> >> that piker, has only about 64 kcal/tbsp, (listed as 21g).
> >>
> >> Returning to butter: 100 kcal/tbsp, 14g. Where is your energy bar now?
> >>
> >> Of all of these, the only one I've known anyone to try using seriously
> >> is honey, which one of my more thoughtful (about nutrition and exercise
> >> science) club-mates uses as an on-bike energy food. He keeps it in a
> >> little squeeze bottle.
> >
> > A major consideration is time and energy required to
> > digest food. I read, but cannot confirm, that honey
> > requires considerable time to digest. Infants definitely
> > should not be fed honey, as their digestion is not
> > mature enough.
> >
>
>
> "Because honey can contain spores of Clostridium botulinum and this has
> been a source of infection for infants, children less than 12 months old
> should not be fed honey. Honey is safe for persons 1 year of age and older."
>
> http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/botulism_g.htm

Thanks.

--
Michael Press

Michael Press

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

In article
<34c48aab-d0dc-47f8-bc99-dd87ecfdbf4b@d4g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:

> On Mar 5, 9:32 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > Infants definitely
> > should not be fed honey, as their digestion is not
> > mature enough.
>
> Infants definitely should not be fed honey, but it's not because their
> digestion isn't mature enough. It's because their immune systems
> aren't mature enough to deal with botulin spores.

Thanks.

--
Michael Press

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

Ted van de Weteringe

01-04-1970, 04:49 AM

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:
> how lardy was he? As fat as Fat Stevie?

It looked like he got off the pot (he was cycling after all) but
hadn't shat for weeks.

> Recently, I got some complaints related to a post I made on the
> Wattage List that included "%^*!@!". No, not the actual words, just
> "%^*!@!". One guy said extreme language such as mine was the reason he
> didn't post.

Well, #$&^#$% 'm.

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 04:50 AM

In article
<ef8887d9-0cf5-4f8a-b1ff-802ee725f936@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:

> On Mar 6, 6:37 am, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> > My 70-year-old wife is chronically & now severely ill. Chronic pain as
> > well. She simply has no appetite, no food is "attractive" at all. She's
> > essentially starving. Just nibble a bit then puts the plate down.
> >
> > I've been urging Ensure Plus or Nutren - both shakes with pretty much the
> > full nutrition needed daily (in addition to say, an egg or piece of toast
> > or Scotch & soda.) Each is about 350 cal in 8 oz (US). But these past two
> > weeks I can't get her to take even three of them daily. "No appetite."
> >
> > So I'm looking for stuff that will have (as much as possible) all the
> > nutrition one needs but, liquid or solid, is a minimum actual volume of
> > material.
>
> Ensure (and Ensure+, Ensure Protein, Ensure yadda yadda) are really
> intended more as supplements than replacements and, since sugar is
> often an appetite stimulant, they make them as sweetened "shakes." As
> a complete nutritional source, they're way too sweet and eventually
> (as you've just discovered) they end up dulling appetite rather than
> stimulating it.
>
> You may have to "reset" your wife's taste buds by mixing up her diet.
> Salty or savory items are an obvious alternative but sometimes sour or
> even slightly bitter can work, too. A problem with Ensure is that it
> doesn't have much aroma and smell is often a good way to stimulate
> appetite. That means that cooking can work better than plopping an
> open can of chocolate shake down in front of her. However, sometimes a
> particular aroma (like roasting meat, or fresh coffee, or mushrooms,
> or catfish in coconut milk with lemongrass and Thai basil) will
> trigger appetite but then the next day it'll make her nauseated.
> Sometimes texture will be tempting, but the next day chewing too much
> will make her gag. Ask her what she ate as a child -- that could give
> you ideas about comfort food that she'll eat. If her appetite is that
> suppressed don't try to cram all necessary nutritive needs into one
> meal. Nutritional density may be secondary to getting her appetite
> back.
>
> > Thanks - I didn't want to detail too much burden on youse but maybe I
> > shoulda.
>
> Only if you want serious answers. This is rbr.

This has turned out to be a weirdly useful conversation...

Robert: what grisly experience taught you all of the above about
appetite stimulation? Because it cannot have been good. I'm hoping it
wasn't anything more scary than spending a lot of time teaching
statistics to doctors.

If you do find the magic food that restores appetite, the only other
thing I can add (I'm going back to butter again here...) is Anthony
Bourdin's advice that butter makes everything better, and is the
not-so-secret ingredient in a lot of restaurant cooking.

For your purposes, not only does cooking in butter or adding extra
butter tend to make everything taste better, it also adds calories.

On the other hand, it will have the effect of making anything it touches
both be and taste richer, which may or may not make it harder to take.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

Abby Sale

01-04-1970, 04:50 AM

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 08:31:37 -0800 (PST), rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:

>...will
>trigger appetite but then the next day it'll make her nauseated.
>Sometimes texture will be tempting, but the next day chewing too much
>will make her gag.

Keen observation. True in this case.

>Ask her what she ate as a child -- that could give
>you ideas about comfort food that she'll eat. If her appetite is that
>suppressed don't try to cram all necessary nutritive needs into one
>meal. Nutritional density may be secondary to getting her appetite
>back.

Good idear. I'll try that. I don't expect a "normal" apetite - too much
illness (not considered teminal at this time, though) and pain meds. But
yes, a gradual rebuilding of "reasonable" might be possible.

-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- ---
I am Abby Sale - in Raleigh, North Carolina

Howard Kveck

01-04-1970, 04:54 AM

In article <rcousine-6BFFEF.23335306032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:

> If you do find the magic food that restores appetite, the only other
> thing I can add (I'm going back to butter again here...) is Anthony
> Bourdin's advice that butter makes everything better, and is the
> not-so-secret ingredient in a lot of restaurant cooking.

That's true, but one other aspect of how restaurants make food taste good is by
using a proper amount of salt. Most people tend to underutilize salt.

> For your purposes, not only does cooking in butter or adding extra
> butter tend to make everything taste better, it also adds calories.
>
> On the other hand, it will have the effect of making anything it touches
> both be and taste richer, which may or may not make it harder to take.

I'm curious about how your theory that butter might be a good bulk nutrition
addition comes into play on a ride. How would one carrya cube and not have it melt?

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 04:54 AM

On Mar 6, 11:33 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> what taught you all of the above about appetite stimulation?

Bad things.

> If you do find the magic food that restores appetite, the only other
> thing I can add (I'm going back to butter again here...) is Anthony
> Bourdin's advice that butter makes everything better,

One of the things you learn about appetite stimulation is that it's
very individual, very culture-specific. I think Benjamin Franklin said
butter doesn't make everything better for all the people all the time.
My wife's family comes running when I make beurre noisette. My mom
would run the other way.

The French think cheese is the solution for a child who is a finicky-
eater. Kid won't eat green beans? Add cheese. Spinach? Cheese. I'm not
sure about andouillette but I'm sure someone's tried it. A friend of
my wife's had problems getting her newborn to suckle. She rubbed
cheese on her nipples. I didn't ask which cheese.

SLAVE of THE STATE

01-04-1970, 04:54 AM

On Mar 6, 11:33*pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> ...the only other
> thing I can add (I'm going back to butter again here...) is Anthony
> Bourdin's advice that butter makes everything better,...

I think the search for credit regarding butter's popularity all leads
to one place: Paula Deen.

http://www.slashfood.com/2006/03/09/paula-deen-drinks-butter/

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 04:55 AM

In article <YOURhoward-5B3EA8.23562206032008@newsgroups.comcast.net>,
Howard Kveck <YOURhoward@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:

> In article <rcousine-6BFFEF.23335306032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
> Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > If you do find the magic food that restores appetite, the only other
> > thing I can add (I'm going back to butter again here...) is Anthony
> > Bourdin's advice that butter makes everything better, and is the
> > not-so-secret ingredient in a lot of restaurant cooking.
>
> That's true, but one other aspect of how restaurants make food taste good
> is by
> using a proper amount of salt. Most people tend to underutilize salt.
>
> > For your purposes, not only does cooking in butter or adding extra
> > butter tend to make everything taste better, it also adds calories.
> >
> > On the other hand, it will have the effect of making anything it touches
> > both be and taste richer, which may or may not make it harder to take.
>
> I'm curious about how your theory that butter might be a good bulk
> nutrition
> addition comes into play on a ride. How would one carrya cube and not have it
> melt?

Melting is a feature, not a bug. Melt the butter, pour it into a squeeze
bottle, add honey to taste. Shove it in your back pocket, go ride.

When you get hungry, the butter will be squeezable and delicious.

Okay, I haven't actually done this, but now I want to.

True story: shortly after I saw my club-mate's honey-eating trick, I
found a liquid-sugar candy thing that was in a squeeze tube and roughly
the consistency of liquid honey.

I bought it and used the (nauseating) candy as food during the next
race. I considered eating the candy in front of my fellow racers a form
of psychological warfare.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

Donald Munro

01-04-1970, 04:56 AM

rechungREMOVETHIS wrote:
> The French think cheese is the solution for a child who is a finicky-
> eater. Kid won't eat green beans? Add cheese. Spinach? Cheese. I'm not
> sure about andouillette but I'm sure someone's tried it. A friend of my
> wife's had problems getting her newborn to suckle. She rubbed cheese on
> her nipples. I didn't ask which cheese.

Butter, now cheese. You're all confusing poor h**2 terribly.

Howard Kveck

01-04-1970, 04:56 AM

In article <c58d0c51-ea64-4621-9d82-2fd65f0c53b8@i7g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com wrote:

> The French think cheese is the solution for a child who is a finicky-
> eater. Kid won't eat green beans? Add cheese. Spinach? Cheese. I'm not
> sure about andouillette but I'm sure someone's tried it. A friend of
> my wife's had problems getting her newborn to suckle. She rubbed
> cheese on her nipples. I didn't ask which cheese.

I'd hope it was a triple cream of some sort.

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Howard Kveck

01-04-1970, 04:59 AM

In article <rcousine-2E6590.19371507032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:

> In article <YOURhoward-5B3EA8.23562206032008@newsgroups.comcast.net>,
> Howard Kveck <YOURhoward@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:

> > I'm curious about how your theory that butter might be a good bulk nutrition
> > addition comes into play on a ride. How would one carrya cube and not have
> > it melt?
>
> Melting is a feature, not a bug. Melt the butter, pour it into a squeeze
> bottle, add honey to taste. Shove it in your back pocket, go ride.
>
> When you get hungry, the butter will be squeezable and delicious.

Hmm, how about vacuum sealing an entire cube. Having it in your jersey pocket
would probably soften it up enough to squeeze fairly quickly.

> Okay, I haven't actually done this, but now I want to.

Heh, let us know the results...

> True story: shortly after I saw my club-mate's honey-eating trick, I
> found a liquid-sugar candy thing that was in a squeeze tube and roughly
> the consistency of liquid honey.
>
> I bought it and used the (nauseating) candy as food during the next
> race. I considered eating the candy in front of my fellow racers a form
> of psychological warfare.

I'm sure it was psychological warfare, but on whom? Them or you?

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 04:59 AM

In article <YOURhoward-489B91.22541607032008@newsgroups.comcast.net>,
Howard Kveck <YOURhoward@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:

> In article <rcousine-2E6590.19371507032008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
> Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <YOURhoward-5B3EA8.23562206032008@newsgroups.comcast.net>,
> > Howard Kveck <YOURhoward@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:
>
> > > I'm curious about how your theory that butter might be a good bulk
> > > nutrition
> > > addition comes into play on a ride. How would one carrya cube and not
> > > have
> > > it melt?
> >
> > Melting is a feature, not a bug. Melt the butter, pour it into a squeeze
> > bottle, add honey to taste. Shove it in your back pocket, go ride.
> >
> > When you get hungry, the butter will be squeezable and delicious.
>
> Hmm, how about vacuum sealing an entire cube. Having it in your jersey
> pocket
> would probably soften it up enough to squeeze fairly quickly.
>
> > Okay, I haven't actually done this, but now I want to.
>
> Heh, let us know the results...
>
> > True story: shortly after I saw my club-mate's honey-eating trick, I
> > found a liquid-sugar candy thing that was in a squeeze tube and roughly
> > the consistency of liquid honey.
> >
> > I bought it and used the (nauseating) candy as food during the next
> > race. I considered eating the candy in front of my fellow racers a form
> > of psychological warfare.
>
> I'm sure it was psychological warfare, but on whom? Them or you?

Hey, I'm the one who wore wool during last weekend's race. The others
are weak.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

bjw@mambo.ucolick.org

01-04-1970, 05:00 AM

On Mar 8, 7:40*am, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 08:31:37 -0800 (PST), rechungREMOVET...@gmail.com wrote:
> >...will
> >trigger appetite but then the next day it'll make her nauseated.
> >Sometimes texture will be tempting, but the next day chewing too much
> >will make her gag.
>
> Keen observation. *True in this case.
>
> >Ask her what she ate as a child -- that could give
> >you ideas about comfort food that she'll eat. If her appetite is that
> >suppressed don't try to cram all necessary nutritive needs into one
> >meal. Nutritional density may be secondary to getting her appetite
> >back.
>
> Good idear. *I'll try that. *I don't expect a "normal" apetite - too much
> illness (not considered teminal at this time, though) and pain meds. *But
> yes, a gradual rebuilding of "reasonable" might be possible.

I don't have experience in this to help you, but
one suggestion. As Robert alluded to, much of
taste and appetite is about smell. It is possible
that her senses of smell and taste are being
affected and that has to do with the loss of appetite.
You might have to experiment with cooking up
various food smells and see if anything prompts
her response.

The other thing, of course, is that we're a bunch
of Masters Fatties and appetite suppression is
alien to us. Ordinarily I would say that in a serious
case, you should be getting advice from a doctor
or nutritionist rather than bike racers - but I also
don't know how helpful the professionals can be.

Ben

Abby Sale

01-04-1970, 05:03 AM

On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 15:18:25 -0800 (PST), "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org"
<bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:

>You might have to experiment with cooking up
>various food smells and see if anything prompts
>her response.
>
Thanks for the reasonable suggestion but that hasn't worked. Evoked a gag
response sometimes.

>The other thing, of course, is that we're a bunch
>of Masters Fatties and appetite suppression is
>alien to us. Ordinarily I would say that in a serious
>case, you should be getting advice from a doctor
>or nutritionist rather than bike racers -

:-)

You'd think so. Frankly, I'm grateful for the suggestions here. Really,
we've tried those routes. Hospitals (she's in and out) seem to feel, like
you, that it's "unnatural" or something to encourage people to eat more.
They vaguely agree and provide one or two Ensure+ or Boost then forget to
provide. Often I bring it in myself. You can believe I've repeatedly
asked.

They haven't a clue - her primary Dr tosses it off with "It's the opioids,
of course." And that's all. As if that solved the need for nutrition!
Only one doc, a friend, of course, and in another state, suggested energy
bars. She's an athlete. That's what got me looking for smaller/better....
which might, I thunk, translate into 'carryable.' I can see now that pure
energy-producing might be more appropriate to racers.

Actually, youse guys have been more helpful than any others, including the
doctors and mountaineers.

Thank you sincerely. I will not inflict myself on you any further.

AJS

-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- ---
I am Abby Sale - in Raleigh, North Carolina

Ryan Cousineau

01-04-1970, 05:06 AM

In article <u118t35mivgjjmq1722h8he6qlhsa20o4s@4ax.com>,
Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_asale@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 15:18:25 -0800 (PST), "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org"
> <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:
>
>
> >You might have to experiment with cooking up
> >various food smells and see if anything prompts
> >her response.
> >
> Thanks for the reasonable suggestion but that hasn't worked. Evoked a gag
> response sometimes.
>
> >The other thing, of course, is that we're a bunch
> >of Masters Fatties and appetite suppression is
> >alien to us. Ordinarily I would say that in a serious
> >case, you should be getting advice from a doctor
> >or nutritionist rather than bike racers -
>
> :-)
>
> You'd think so. Frankly, I'm grateful for the suggestions here. Really,
> we've tried those routes. Hospitals (she's in and out) seem to feel, like
> you, that it's "unnatural" or something to encourage people to eat more.
> They vaguely agree and provide one or two Ensure+ or Boost then forget to
> provide. Often I bring it in myself. You can believe I've repeatedly
> asked.
>
> They haven't a clue - her primary Dr tosses it off with "It's the opioids,
> of course." And that's all. As if that solved the need for nutrition!
> Only one doc, a friend, of course, and in another state, suggested energy
> bars. She's an athlete. That's what got me looking for smaller/better....
> which might, I thunk, translate into 'carryable.' I can see now that pure
> energy-producing might be more appropriate to racers.
>
> Actually, youse guys have been more helpful than any others, including the
> doctors and mountaineers.
>
> Thank you sincerely. I will not inflict myself on you any further.

Please do inflict yourself on us further. This is more topical than our
usual nonsense, we're flattered to have been useful, and we want to hear
the outcome.

Interesting what you say about the doctors. Last year my mother-in-law,
a diabetic who does not use insulin but eats quite carefully to keep it
that way, had to go into the hospital for a hernia.

The food they fed her was insane. First off, in theory she is not a
vegetarian but in practice she very nearly is. She certainly wasn't
going to eat any of the mystery meats the hospital was serving. We
expressed this to the staff, and they ignored our requests that she be
given vegetarian meals. They gave her apple juice as a routine beverage.
Apple juice!

So now we have a diabetic who is barely eating her normal food but is
drinking a fair bit of apple juice, and her blood sugar was all over the
place. But since the hospital already had an IV line in her, they seemed
to be following the protocol that they could feed her whatever, then
test blood sugar and use insulin to keep it in line.

In practice, that left her barely eating solid food, and bouncing
between hypo and hyper almost continuously. She lost a ludicrous amount
of weight during her prolonged and infection-ridden recovery.

I understand that medicine needs to build up a protocol that works
consistently, but I felt that there was a real sense of hammering the
square peg of my mother-in-law's carefully-worked-out personal best
practices into the round hole of standard practice.

The end of the story is that she got better and after that prolonged
recovery, the hernia operation left her healthier and with notably
improved quality of life. She didn't much enjoy the process, though.

The doctors and nurses probably regarded the dietary issue as
essentially secondary. She wasn't likely to starve to death, and they
were concerned about infection control and post-op complications: the
stuff that could acutely maim or kill her.

There is probably much of the same issue going on with you and yours,
but that doesn't make your concerns unreasonable.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

rechungREMOVETHIS@gmail.com

01-04-1970, 05:06 AM

On Mar 9, 9:17 am, Abby Sale <NO_SPAM_as...@ft.newyorklife.com> wrote:

> Thanks for the reasonable suggestion but that hasn't worked. Evoked a gag
> response sometimes.

Yeah. Although an aroma that stimulates appetite can sometimes turn
around and make her gag, unfortunately once somone gags that aroma may
not turn around again and work in the future.

Hospitals and physicians are designed to deal with acute care. Your
wife's situation is something they really aren't well-equipped to
handle.

Good luck and best wishes.

Kyle Legate

01-04-1970, 05:06 AM

Abby Sale wrote:
> On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 15:18:25 -0800 (PST), "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org"
> <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:
>
>
>> You might have to experiment with cooking up
>> various food smells and see if anything prompts
>> her response.
>>
> Thanks for the reasonable suggestion but that hasn't worked. Evoked a gag
> response sometimes.
>
>> The other thing, of course, is that we're a bunch
>> of Masters Fatties and appetite suppression is
>> alien to us. Ordinarily I would say that in a serious
>> case, you should be getting advice from a doctor
>> or nutritionist rather than bike racers -
>
> :-)
>
> You'd think so. Frankly, I'm grateful for the suggestions here. Really,
> we've tried those routes. Hospitals (she's in and out) seem to feel, like
> you, that it's "unnatural" or something to encourage people to eat more.
> They vaguely agree and provide one or two Ensure+ or Boost then forget to
> provide. Often I bring it in myself. You can believe I've repeatedly
> asked.
>
> They haven't a clue - her primary Dr tosses it off with "It's the opioids,
> of course." And that's all. As if that solved the need for nutrition!
> Only one doc, a friend, of course, and in another state, suggested energy
> bars. She's an athlete. That's what got me looking for smaller/better....
> which might, I thunk, translate into 'carryable.' I can see now that pure
> energy-producing might be more appropriate to racers.
>
I would recommend some nice, potent weed.
Munchies will fatten her up in no time.