Angliru

[Robert Chung]

Yikes.

[Bob Schwartz]

Robert Chung wrote:
> Yikes.

Wonder if LANCE was watching.

Bob Schwartz

[Keith]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 09:40:28 -0700, "Robert Chung"
<anonymous.coward@invalid.address> wrote:

>Yikes.

Yes, but TV really doesn't do justice to these slopes, wonder if
they'll find a way to show it how it really is. There is a 12% grade I
know of, I can barely walk up, now 23%...

[Keith]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 12:26:11 -0500, Bob Schwartz
<bob.schwartz@REMOVEsbcglobal.net> wrote:

>Robert Chung wrote:
>> Yikes.
>
>Wonder if LANCE was watching.

I was thinking the same, unless Contador is injured I don't see how LA
can beat him in the mountains, unless he makes him work for him! Why
would he though...

[billb]

On Sep 13, 1:49*pm, Keith <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 12:26:11 -0500, Bob Schwartz
>
> <bob.schwa...@REMOVEsbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >Robert Chung wrote:
> >> Yikes.
>
> >Wonder if LANCE was watching.
>
> I was thinking the same, unless Contador is injured I don't see how LA
> can beat him in the mountains, unless he makes him work for him! Why
> would he though...

Angliru is not as tough as Mt. Washington (8+ miles @ 12% avg. with
really bad weather and 30% dirt) and Danielson and Hamilton rode that
very fast and LA always spanked both of them on tough climbs. It will
be interesting.
Best,
Bill Black

[Jan]

Keith wrote:
> On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 09:40:28 -0700, "Robert Chung"
> <anonymous.coward@invalid.address> wrote:
>
>> Yikes.
>
> Yes, but TV really doesn't do justice to these slopes, wonder if
> they'll find a way to show it how it really is. There is a 12% grade I
> know of, I can barely walk up, now 23%...



We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's tough,
really tough. The riders were really suffering.

Jan

[RicodJour]

On Sep 13, 2:47*pm, "Jan" <j...@freeinternet.com> wrote:
>
> We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
> We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's tough,
> really tough. The riders were really suffering.

Where and when will you be posting the pictures?

R

[Keith]

>> Yes, but TV really doesn't do justice to these slopes, wonder if
>> they'll find a way to show it how it really is. There is a 12% grade I
>> know of, I can barely walk up, now 23%...
>
>
>
>We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
>We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's tough,
>really tough. The riders were really suffering.

Great, hope you were to take some pics that give a sense of the slope.
I wonder how anyone can ride up a 21% slope, just like hitting a wall.

Nice race but it didn't seem to be as hard as the Zoncolan during last
year's Giro, that one is really steep from beginning to end, no lower
gradients anywhere.

On the other hand the weather makes a big difference, I remember that
in 2002 I watched it on OLN and the rain really made it terrible, heck
even cars were losing traction in some parts;

[raamman@gmail.com]

On Sep 13, 2:07*pm, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 13, 2:47*pm, "Jan" <j...@freeinternet.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
> > We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's tough,
> > really tough. The riders were really suffering.
>
> Where and when will you be posting the pictures?
>
> R

I had a very keen interest in that stage; I was really hoping levi
would do it; it would provide some ecouragement for lance in his quest
I think. I'm not surprised at the result, glad he got 2nd at least.
too bad about sastre, but it was clear that riis was going to burn him
off for not resigning.

I'm still considering the 12hr vuelta dvd set from world cycling
produtions, think it'll be worth it ?

[John Forrest Tomlinson]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 12:23:30 -0700 (PDT), raamman@gmail.com wrote:

>On Sep 13, 2:07*pm, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
>> On Sep 13, 2:47*pm, "Jan" <j...@freeinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
>> > We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's tough,
>> > really tough. The riders were really suffering.
>>
>> Where and when will you be posting the pictures?
>>
>> R
>
>I had a very keen interest in that stage; I was really hoping levi
>would do it; it would provide some ecouragement for lance in his quest
>I think. I'm not surprised at the result, glad he got 2nd at least.
>too bad about sastre, but it was clear that riis was going to burn him
>off for not resigning.
>
>I'm still considering the 12hr vuelta dvd set from world cycling
>produtions, think it'll be worth it ?

My respect for Leipheimer is growing. Two grand tour podiums in two
years while helping his captain win.

[Robert Chung]

John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:

> My respect for Leipheimer is growing. Two grand tour podiums in two
> years while helping his captain win.

Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or Valverde's
performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and looks to be in good
shape for the podium.

[RicodJour]

On Sep 13, 4:01*pm, John Forrest Tomlinson <usenetrem...@jt10000.com>
wrote:
>
> My respect for Leipheimer is growing. *Two grand tour podiums in two
> years while helping his captain win.

And he's got a hot wife. That's a hell of a Plan B.

R

[Keith]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 13:38:31 -0700, "Robert Chung"
<anonymous.coward@invalid.address> wrote:

>John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:
>
>> My respect for Leipheimer is growing. Two grand tour podiums in two
>> years while helping his captain win.
>
>Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or Valverde's
>performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and looks to be in good
>shape for the podium.

And while it was not very easy to figure out for sure, it seems he
made time on Contador in the last 2k after dropping Sastre. Leppy
seems to be in the shape of his life, too bad Contador didn't pass on
the Vuelta.

[Tom Kunich]

"Robert Chung" <anonymous.coward@invalid.address> wrote in message
news:%wVyk.211$be.113@nlpi061.nbdc.sbc.com...
> John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:
>
>> My respect for Leipheimer is growing. Two grand tour podiums in two
>> years while helping his captain win.
>
> Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or Valverde's
> performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and looks to be in
> good shape for the podium.

If that's a surprise to you, I suspect you haven't been paying very close
attention to the way Levi has started riding in the last two years. His fear
of success has almost completely disappeared. He has started riding to his
limits instead of to what others thought as his limits. He's changed so
completely since he rode for Gerolsteiner.

[Jan]

Keith wrote:
>>> Yes, but TV really doesn't do justice to these slopes, wonder if
>>> they'll find a way to show it how it really is. There is a 12%
>>> grade I know of, I can barely walk up, now 23%...
>>
>>
>>
>> We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
>> We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's
>> tough, really tough. The riders were really suffering.
>
> Great, hope you were to take some pics that give a sense of the slope.
> I wonder how anyone can ride up a 21% slope, just like hitting a wall.
>
> Nice race but it didn't seem to be as hard as the Zoncolan during last
> year's Giro, that one is really steep from beginning to end, no lower
> gradients anywhere.
>
> On the other hand the weather makes a big difference, I remember that
> in 2002 I watched it on OLN and the rain really made it terrible, heck
> even cars were losing traction in some parts;

Fortunately the weather was ok today, we've been up the climb during foul
weather -the year Millar threw his bike.- it was really horrible up there.
What was suprising was the number of riders asking the spectators for a
push, the pace must have been really fast on the lower slopes.

Jan

[Keith]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:01:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
<ricodjour@worldemail.com> wrote:

>On Sep 13, 4:01Â*pm, John Forrest Tomlinson <usenetrem...@jt10000.com>
>wrote:
>>
>> My respect for Leipheimer is growing. Â*Two grand tour podiums in two
>> years while helping his captain win.
>
>And he's got a hot wife. That's a hell of a Plan B.

got a pic ?

[Robert Chung]

Tom Kunich wrote:

>> Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or
>> Valverde's performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and
>> looks to be in good shape for the podium.
>
> If that's a surprise to you, I suspect you haven't been paying very
> close attention to the way Levi has started riding in the last two
> years. His fear of success has almost completely disappeared. He has
> started riding to his limits instead of to what others thought as his
> limits. He's changed so completely since he rode for Gerolsteiner.

So you're saying when Leipheimer starting riding for Bruyneel at age 33 his
performance suddenly got better?

[Keith]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:22:24 -0700, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo.
com> wrote:

>"Robert Chung" <anonymous.coward@invalid.address> wrote in message
>news:%wVyk.211$be.113@nlpi061.nbdc.sbc.com...
>> John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:
>>
>>> My respect for Leipheimer is growing. Two grand tour podiums in two
>>> years while helping his captain win.
>>
>> Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or Valverde's
>> performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and looks to be in
>> good shape for the podium.
>
>If that's a surprise to you, I suspect you haven't been paying very close
>attention to the way Levi has started riding in the last two years. His fear
>of success has almost completely disappeared. He has started riding to his
>limits instead of to what others thought as his limits. He's changed so
>completely since he rode for Gerolsteiner.

Again Kunich shoes he's clueless when it comes to analyzing racing, I
take it you blanked out during the 2006 tour ? I thought so...

[Tom Kunich]

"Robert Chung" <anonymous.coward@invalid.address> wrote in message
news:jkWyk.220$W06.17@flpi148.ffdc.sbc.com...
> Tom Kunich wrote:
>
>>> Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or
>>> Valverde's performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and
>>> looks to be in good shape for the podium.
>>
>> If that's a surprise to you, I suspect you haven't been paying very
>> close attention to the way Levi has started riding in the last two
>> years. His fear of success has almost completely disappeared. He has
>> started riding to his limits instead of to what others thought as his
>> limits. He's changed so completely since he rode for Gerolsteiner.
>
> So you're saying when Leipheimer starting riding for Bruyneel at age 33
> his performance suddenly got better?

His RACING got better. Maybe you don't know the difference between
performance and racing?

[Bob Schwartz]

Robert Chung wrote:
> Tom Kunich wrote:
>
>>> Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or
>>> Valverde's performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and
>>> looks to be in good shape for the podium.
>> If that's a surprise to you, I suspect you haven't been paying very
>> close attention to the way Levi has started riding in the last two
>> years. His fear of success has almost completely disappeared. He has
>> started riding to his limits instead of to what others thought as his
>> limits. He's changed so completely since he rode for Gerolsteiner.
>
> So you're saying when Leipheimer starting riding for Bruyneel at age 33 his
> performance suddenly got better?

The last two years he's ridden like a Ferrari rather than a Volkswagen.

Bob Schwartz

[Stu Fleming]

Robert Chung wrote:

> So you're saying when Leipheimer starting riding for Bruyneel at age 33 his
> performance suddenly got better?

Statistically, has that ever happened before?

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> Fortunately the weather was ok today, we've been up the climb during foul
> weather -the year Millar threw his bike.- it was really horrible up there.
> What was suprising was the number of riders asking the spectators for a
> push, the pace must have been really fast on the lower slopes.
>
> Jan

Jan: Am I reading you correctly, that riders were actually *asking* for
pushes? In the 'Tour, they at least pretend to shoo them away (and sometimes
get penalized even when the pushing is being "discouraged" by the rider).

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


"Jan" <jan@freeinternet.com> wrote in message
news:6j2upsF15r1pU1@mid.individual.net...
> Keith wrote:
>>>> Yes, but TV really doesn't do justice to these slopes, wonder if
>>>> they'll find a way to show it how it really is. There is a 12%
>>>> grade I know of, I can barely walk up, now 23%...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We've just arrived back at the hotel after our trek up Angrilu.
>>> We were stood about 6k fronm the finish on the 21% section.....it's
>>> tough, really tough. The riders were really suffering.
>>
>> Great, hope you were to take some pics that give a sense of the slope.
>> I wonder how anyone can ride up a 21% slope, just like hitting a wall.
>>
>> Nice race but it didn't seem to be as hard as the Zoncolan during last
>> year's Giro, that one is really steep from beginning to end, no lower
>> gradients anywhere.
>>
>> On the other hand the weather makes a big difference, I remember that
>> in 2002 I watched it on OLN and the rain really made it terrible, heck
>> even cars were losing traction in some parts;
>
> Fortunately the weather was ok today, we've been up the climb during foul
> weather -the year Millar threw his bike.- it was really horrible up there.
> What was suprising was the number of riders asking the spectators for a
> push, the pace must have been really fast on the lower slopes.
>
> Jan
>
>

[Keith]

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 16:30:09 -0700, "Mike Jacoubowsky"
<MikeJ@ChainReaction.com> wrote:

>> Fortunately the weather was ok today, we've been up the climb during foul
>> weather -the year Millar threw his bike.- it was really horrible up there.
>> What was suprising was the number of riders asking the spectators for a
>> push, the pace must have been really fast on the lower slopes.
>>
>> Jan
>
>Jan: Am I reading you correctly, that riders were actually *asking* for
>pushes? In the 'Tour, they at least pretend to shoo them away (and sometimes
>get penalized even when the pushing is being "discouraged" by the rider).

The leaders maybe, I doubt it's the same past the 20th placed,
apparently in 2002 most of the non-contenders were pushed up!

[zzfranklin@mac.com]

On Sep 13, 8:03*pm, Bob Schwartz <bob.schwa...@REMOVEsbcglobal.net>
wrote:
> Robert Chung wrote:
> > Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> >>> Yeah. The surprise of the day wasn't so much Contador's win, or
> >>> Valverde's performance--it was that Leipheimer finished fourth and
> >>> looks to be in good shape for the podium.
> >> If that's a surprise to you, I suspect you haven't been paying very
> >> close attention to the way Levi has started riding in the last two
> >> years. His fear of success has almost completely disappeared. He has
> >> started riding to his limits instead of to what others thought as his
> >> limits. He's changed so completely since he rode for Gerolsteiner.
>
> > So you're saying when Leipheimer starting riding for Bruyneel at age 33 his
> > performance suddenly got better?
>
> The last two years he's ridden like a Ferrari rather than a Volkswagen.
>
> Bob Schwartz

Unfortunately for him Lance is Schumi.

[Robert Chung]

Bob Schwartz wrote:

> The last two years he's ridden like a Ferrari rather than a
> Volkswagen.

Hmmm. He did it again today.

[Jan]

Keith wrote:
> On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 16:30:09 -0700, "Mike Jacoubowsky"
> <MikeJ@ChainReaction.com> wrote:
>
>>> Fortunately the weather was ok today, we've been up the climb
>>> during foul weather -the year Millar threw his bike.- it was really
>>> horrible up there. What was suprising was the number of riders
>>> asking the spectators for a push, the pace must have been really
>>> fast on the lower slopes.
>>>
>>> Jan
>>
>> Jan: Am I reading you correctly, that riders were actually *asking*
>> for pushes? In the 'Tour, they at least pretend to shoo them away
>> (and sometimes get penalized even when the pushing is being
>> "discouraged" by the rider).
>
> The leaders maybe, I doubt it's the same past the 20th placed,
> apparently in 2002 most of the non-contenders were pushed up!

Obviously not the top guys, nor any of the easily recognized riders ie We
couldn't name them !!! All of Galicia team got a push- from the same man,
either a very dedicated fan or someone "placed" there to do it.
Other riders were either asking for a push or were accepting offers from the
crowd. Rabo, Milram, Liquigas, Cofidis, CA all had pushes.

Weather fantastic for specataors today, we had a marvellous spot just past
5k to finish, with stunning views of the race from the valley below and the
hairpins. Astana CdeP and Euskatel staying at our hotel. Going to the start
tomorrow

Jan

[Ted van de Weteringe]

Keith schreef:
> On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:01:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour wrote:
>> And he's got a hot wife. That's a hell of a Plan B.
>
> got a pic ?

http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=odessa+levi

[Keith]

On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 20:07:48 +0200, Ted van de Weteringe
<myfullname@xs4all.nl.invalid> wrote:

>Keith schreef:
>> On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:01:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour wrote:
>>> And he's got a hot wife. That's a hell of a Plan B.
>>
>> got a pic ?
>
>http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=odessa+levi

Thanks, not bad, you see...hum...a"bit more" in this one
http://photos31.flickr.com/35337279_bd2e2b84a9.jpg

[Bob Schwartz]

Ted van de Weteringe wrote:
> Keith schreef:
>> On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:01:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour wrote:
>>> And he's got a hot wife. That's a hell of a Plan B.
>>
>> got a pic ?
>
> http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=odessa+levi

Dude, are you taking over for Lafferty?

Bob Schwartz